I also think it’s weird that in order for some people to be allowed to freely call out basic obvious human ideas and thoughts that they have to FIRST change a narrative. When I and others first condemned the destructive violence (which included many physical attacks of people) of the mobs and expressed sadness and anger, I was called racist (I never even knew what the supposed race of such people were, and I am also the first to say it is absolutely a mixed group with plenty of white people), but then as things continued and people found themselves in a weird pickle as they wanted to condemn the same, they suddenly said that it was “white supremacists” doing it. Okay? Why were you supporting these white supremacists, then? And why was I racist for condemning what is now said to be the doings of white supremacists?
Do I think white supremacists are involved in this mess? You bet your ass, I do. But I think most of them are enjoying it and egging it all on from the safety of their own homes from behind a computer screen. They are cowards now and always have been. But people enjoy painting a scene that works to their own convenience so they can feel better about themselves. As soon as I saw that stupid viral “ANTIFA” tweet saying they were coming into the neighborhoods to take over . . . I knew that was a bunch of bullshit too. Not because I think Antifa is a great group, but because they’re not THAT stupid. It was clearly a diversion by someone else, but people love picking up any image or word they can find anywhere and waving it as proof of something. Because God forbid we actually do any investigation into facts and information or evaluate something with a critical mind.
I saw a really strange video the other night of cops destroying one of their own cars. I still don’t know what I saw and would like to know more. Of course the people sharing it and commenting on it were running with “They are destroying their car so that they can tell everyone that they were attacked by protestors and can blame them!!!” That’s possible, but honestly it’s too weird for me to just accept without any further challenge or context (especially in view of many witnesses with camera phones). But, yeah, what the fuck was really happening? Was it like setting “back fires” to try and keep chaos from growing? Was it already destroyed a bit and they wanted to dismantle it completely so it doesn’t get hotwired and used as a weapon in the same neighborhood? I don’t know (and I’ll do some more research today as it is driving me nuts now, hahaha). But the way people take an isolated image or quote or literally ANYTHING and assign “their” truth to it to justify whatever they like . . . . it’s scary on all sides.
I brought this up in a post earlier towards the top
“Well, there seems to be some evidence that cops are taking a page outta Russia’s KGB playbook and sending in plain clothes cops to infiltrate a group and then Start breaking windows and starting violence to delegitimize the group. Thats not to say people aren’t being destructive and looting but there may not be as much or as bad if there wasn’t an example presented by the authorities.”
Why does it have to be that way? “Bludgeoning people with a litany of texts”? So discussion is frowned upon? Everyone else is allowed to post their thoughts but there is no rebuttal allowed? that seems insincere and really just horrible for a “Discussion board.” Honestly man, if you can’t or are unwilling to respond to me why are you putting that on me? That’s on you…
It’s not an argument, it’s a discussion. But people get butt hurt when they are challenged and so it becomes personal. and I’m the asshole. I’m not challenging you. As rick sanchez says. I’m explaining why I’m right. If you don’t want to hear/read it, that’s not on me, but it doesn’t really lend a whole lot of credibility to your gripes and accustions.
Well, if you read what I responded to you with, you would know I address this. You would know that innocent people are being caught up in the police brutality that is the looting and the rioting. So really it’s not the property damage that you’re upset with it’s the police brutality. The police brutality caused this.You abhor racism but all you can seem to talk about is the property damage. That’s a disconnect.
I admit that was probably a little too blunt but you gotta admit, you’ve given very little attention to the racism that this is about and a ton of attention to the fall out from it. That, to me, is misguided and hurts the recovery process because it doesn’t fix the problem or even address it. I think it’s very egocentric… “It’s not a problem until it affects me personally,” I don’t think you and acid are racist, I think you are very level headed and have a decent moral compass. But I think you guys are scared (with good reason) and are focusing on the immediate threat to you rather than over all threat that creates the conditions of this immediate threat. Solving the immediate threat does not save your house or your business because without justice being served THIS WILL HAPPEN AGAIN.
Simply put, What did you think was gonna happen when we ignore this shit? You HAVE to expect a reaction and you can’t bitch and moan when the reaction that you don’t want shows up, especially when we have done nothing to stop this shit in the first place.
This isn’t about you personally. This is about us.This is about us as a civil society. When I say “you haven’t don’t enough to stop the racism and the injustice.” I don’t mean YOU, QUEER BAIT, I mean you in the general term as in the common everyday person/community/country/society that pretends not to see the horrible shit around us.
Well of course not when you can’t be arsed to read any of it. So you’re giving an opinion on something you fully admit you didn’t read. So if it’s not important or fully explains the situation you (yes, you queer bait, this time) don’t know because you haven’t read. and this lack of communication and understanding is where feelings get hurt and communication breaks down. If I don’t fully explain the situation tell me where I’m wrong. Let’s open a line of dialogue and communicate but you can’t cause you didn’t read… and more of our stubborn members here just wanna write some shit and not defend it. they just want their post/opinion to be the ultimate authority with no challenges to it. I welcome challenges to my posts.(which is why I write so much in response, I feel it sharpens my own opinions.) Funny enough, I like discussing here on the Discussion Board. Boggles my mind that people wouldn’t want to read what some one wrote here on a board dedicated to reading and writing!
Sure, you can feel that way. It’s not accurate, and you probably feel that way because you apparently shut down and skip my posts when their not what you want hear/read. My “attack” is my explanation that apparently is frowned upon here on a “discussion board” WHo woulda thought discussion would be frowned upon on a discussion board? I agree with you, I do feel like I know more than others based on the simple fact that I’m able to explain myself (or at least try to) when others just get pissed and shut down because I’ve popped their balloon. If they are so smart and are so right, how come their opinion falls apart after about one round of questioning. How come thy are not able to defend their stances? How come it’s not my fault they can’t be articulate?
Look, brother, I like ya’ man, I think we over all agree with each other, but I think you’re misguided on this blame thing. and I suppose it’s easy to be that way when, as acid points out, you’re neighborhood is on fire. BUT if we’re gonna point fingers during this let’s put the blame where it lies. These looters and rioter have reason to be behaving the way they are, if it wasn’t for the corrupted justice system. So it’s not looters and rioters burning down neighborhoods. it’s the cops. So if we’re gonna talk about it in terms of property damage, let’s keep it in perspective and call it what it is. The cops destroying your neighborhood.
I’m not your enemy, dude. and i do feel for what what yo’re going through in a big city. I hope you stay safe.
Exactly my point. All we did was take care of the immediate threat to property and ignore the racist justice system and low and behold here it is again. and who’s at the center? Cops. This is my point.
The black community has been dealing with this for literally HUNDREDS of years… why it is a problem when it happens to others? Why is it a problem when it happens outside of the black community? Nobody is innocent if we did nothing to stop it. That’s my point. We are all complicit. This is a group effort, not just looters and rioters.
I said before, this isn’t about solving anything. this is about retribution. This is "see how you like it? This is, “You, involved now!?” This is, “Look, bitch, my denial of rights effects you too!”
Thanks Brother I look forward to your rebuttal.
Are you describing the victims of protests or the black community? cause really it could go either way. It would be a shame if youre only recognizing the three days that the majority had to deal with it and not the life long condition that is the black experieince.
I’m all for that. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying looting and rioting and burning shit down it right, I’m saying it is to be expected. theres a huge difference. If you go out in a blizzard with no jacket you can’t be pissed that you got hypothermia and complain that the way for nature to handle you was to just give you a cold. That’s what happens!
Also, regarding Kaepernick and whomever else is making claims to pay for protestors’ bail and/or lawyer fees. I really hope there’s follow up (and follow THROUGH) on that later. I don’t agree with the dude on everything, but I totally supported the players taking a knee during the anthem and find it ridiculous that it was so controversial.
“When civility leads to death, revolting is the only logical reaction.
The cries for peace will rain down, and when they do, they will land on deaf ears, because your violence has brought this resistance.
We have the right to fight back!
Rest in Power George Floyd” – Colin Kaepernick
I think it’s okay for me as an American to question the possible reckless implications of such a call to combat along with holding him to his promise (I’ve not seen the actual claim of paying for lawyers, so disregard all of this if the references were false to begin with). But, I also feel it my duty to call out when Trump is puffing his chest and shouting about restoring “Law and Order” through Military force, because the laws and order are precisely what are NOT working for a large portion of Americans. He seems to be meeting the cries of unfair force and oppression . . . . with, well, more force and oppression.
Most people now see that “restoring” or “maintaining” order is not what is most critical and helpful in the long run. We need a fixing and upgrade of order, and perhaps even a redefining of what order actually means to us. Yes, I want my neighborhood safe and I also want to be treated with dignity and care, even if I find myself in a situation where I’m being dealt with by police. But I don’t want that ONLY for myself, and frankly, if it’s at the expense of others, it’s going to make me feel quite sick and undeserving of any such “service”. I’d rather take my chances on my own than be sheltered and protected by monsters. But again, I don’t think we should give ANY people a pass on horrid behavior just because some people endure stuff that is horrid (cops face really horrid situations too, actually).
Wasn’t OJ’s freedom (as implied and interpreted by some) supposed to be a certain type of payment for injustices committed against certain people too?
Now a lot of people demand we string up ALL the cops. And then what? If we trade lives as currency and bargaining chips, what’s the point of anything?
Again, the black experience… As the majority we only put up with it when it hits us and ignore it when it’s everyone else, Well everyone else is bringing it to us!
It’s the average joe that is in the most position to help each other.(BUT WE’RE NOT, and that’s why the anger) sure we don’t have money but we have numbers. There is more of us than there is of them and yet we still let a few bully and murder the most vulnerable among us. That’s the rage. That we let them get away with it. That’s why they are fucking us up now, cause we didn’t help. With all of our numbers we just let it happen. Not saying it’s right just saying that’s what it is.
Right on the money (so to speak.)
YES!!! Exactly
I’m loving what I’m reading, sir. You get it.
God, I hope you’re right. I will be front and center ready to lend a hand for any and all that need it. Although, Ive tried to do that any way with my life because that’s what people should do for people. I believe the lesser members or former members of this forum would call me “communist” or “socialist” in the past because of that.
I love you, dude! I hope more listen to you. You aren’t as controversial as I am. But you’re saying everything that I agree with and have been trying to say.
Oh, come on not you too! I don’t attack. I explain. I totally listen to others that’s why I respond in lengthy walls of texts. I want to make sure I cover all points.
Me too.
I think the two party system has given way to what we see now. You have people who don’t know what they believe they just choose a side like a football team and then root for their side even though it’s totally against their best interests.but it’s about winning rather than substance.
That was actually George W. W put that in motion Obama had no real choice but to sign the check because W had already allocated the funds during his last term in office. Only a third of Americans (34%) correctly say the Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP) was enacted by the Bush administration. (https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2010/08/10/was-tarp-passed-under-bush-or-obama/ )
I think this is disingenuous. I think the Trump side is demonstrably shown to be racist time and time again. Biden wins by default when it comes not being racist. When those are the only two options we get, we vote for the less racist and hope there’s an even less version of a racist candidate next time. Biden represents Progress (as weak as it is) that’s what you vote for. Despite the narrative that the right pushes “both sides” don’t do it. at lest not to the extent that the right does.
You gotta admit the people connected with trump are pretty deplorable. She wasn’t wrong.
YOu are 100% correct, How do we do this though? Many rednecks revel in their ignorance. DJ had no thought of trying to improve things. He didn’t want learn, he didn’t want to know, he just wanted bask in his privilege and give the finger to everyone else. How do you reach that? What do you do with that? Admittedly here on the board my way isn’t the answer, but I got selfish in taking him down a peg and calling out his stupidity and bigotry. I figured he was a lost cause so i gave in to lesser behavior in ridiculing him.
I see those people who shout about coming together, aren’t as against coming together, they are against the people who are against coming together. (God damn that wordy) There is no room for exclusionary people in our inclusive country. So, that to me, is not the same thing.
Excellent, Not all cops!
Good, GREAT!! and unfortunately this act has become radical. We live in a country of fear and we’re all supposed to fear our neighbor! Fuck that!! Good for you Gunnar. I’ve been having a beer with my neighbor (who is black) off and on for the last two weeks. You know we’d wave at each other and our kids would play together but we never hung out. He came over abut two weeks ago when I was sitting in the drive way one evening. I offered him a chair and he offered me a beer and it just kinda went from there. Great guy. But in 10 years we’ve never hung out.
I hope it gets better. I hope we actively work at making it better. Cause it will happen again, if not.
You most definitely have the right to question his “reckless” statement, but it’s dishonest and ignores the problem that caused the statement in the first place. the call to fight back is not reckless given the context of the situation in which it was made.
If we hold these people accountable we don’t have to question kapernick’s statement because he would never need to make it. Our focus is wrong. It’s not the reaction that’s the problem it’s what caused the reaction. If there is no cause then there is no reaction.
well said.
Not really the same thing. OJ was a personal situation, (admittedly affecting us all) not addressing anything with society at large. And anybody stating that him being cleared of murder was “payback” is an idiot.
Anybody suggesting this is dumb too. NOT all cops. But all cops do have a duty to weed out and report the corruption within their numbers. There should be no such thing as professional courtesy among cops. People Diie when that happens…
Those three cops watching Mr. Floyd is the perfect metaphor for our country… Yeah, they didn’t kill Mr. Floyd but they didn’t stop it either, they just watched, just like we have for many years. And guess what? Do they get a pass because they didn’t actively Kill Mr. Floyd? No, that death affected them in that they lost their job (And should be charged). Just as those cops did nothing, so did we, and now just like those cops we are affected by it by our neighborhoods burning.
Since 9/11 I’ve been treated fucking horribly by police, TSA, ICE, and anything and everything else with a badge and a gun, and while I’m not black, I’m certainly NOT white. I got “the talk” from my white mother when I hit my teenage years and developed a beard and a smooth baritone, and it’s nuts to me that there are many people whom I’ve known my whole life that due to their race and background never had to fear the people that supposedly protect us.
It’s very telling in all of this discourse, both on and off the boards, who has and who has not been held at gunpoint for just BEING, and who has and has not had a life-threatening panic attack from something as mundane as a routine traffic stop.
(Side-note: as a Mexican-American, the worst, most bigoted cops are Latino cops. Go figure.)
My best friend in my city is black. I am very, very worried for him, and he is very, very worried for me.
We tried nonviolent protest, and they still keep cappin’ us.
Times is tight, stakes is high. Sorry if I’m vomiting all my fears and worries on this board, and while I do value all the discourse here and all your perspectives, I don’t need nor could benefit from a thorough dissection of my post. This is my reality, not yours, and until you’ve been there, you will NEVER know.
UPSIDE TO THIS SHITSHOW WE CALL THE YEAR OF OUR LORD 2k20: A customer at work gave me her number completely outta the blue. Nothing like a global pandemic and a potential civil war to set the mood!
I don’t post political shit on facebook or anywhere really, but i did here a few times. But i’m so disgusted with the racism I could fucking puke. Every fucking day I see a new video of some old white man doing what he can to stop what is currently happening. It’s even a few of my distant fucking relatives (step-side of the family). It’s people I work with. It’s fucking everywhere. So much so that’s it’s really polarizing this country.
I saw that bullshit. Honestly I’ve seen so much (usually police) brutality in the past week I think I actually need to pause watching it so that I don’t become desensitized and I can stay mad at the system.
If any of you haven’t watched the documentary 12th on Netflix (and I’ve heard it’s free on Youtube right now too), you should. I thought because I understood the ideas behind the movie I didn’t need to actually watch it. I needed to watch it. It’s like reading the prequel chapter to this whole mess.
It’s funny, because the shitty narrative started with the Republican rally cry of “Well, what about the otherside?” And nobody stood up and said “The other side of right is wrong, so STFU.”
And then the other rally cry (Which seems to be used only to legitimize Republican atrocity) “Well, both sides do it.” This is bullshit, because both sides don’t “do it.” And they point to groups like “Antifa” who are “just as violent to the people they don’t like,” as if it’s the same thing. Theyre not the same things. If Pro hate groups go away, Antifa goes away. If Antifa goes away the Pro hate groups still exist.
When it comes to reporting of left and right crime, the two parties generally fall consistently into 1 of 2 categories cheating on a marriage or relationship and theft. Now, obviously you got outliers that fall into the opposite camps but just as a rule of thumb…
For the most Part Democrat criminals are usually Marriage vow criminals. Prostitution, (Although lots of 'Pubs too in those Madam’s black books) Cheating on a spouse, taking advantage of their position of authority to get some, soliciting sex on-line… basically crimes against their marriage vows.
Republican Crime is generally all theft. People work 40 years looking to retire have their retirement stolen because of some fucked government official grifted away the retirement fund. Or republicans embezzling money from a campaign etc… CEOs generally tend to be republican, how often do we hear the company is closing, thousands of workers laid off but the CEO gets millions in bonuses as they shut the doors? Republicans taking bribes to look the other way over something unjust or to instill something unjust… It’s all money crimes.
cheating on your spouse effects primarily two people, you and your spouse. Stealing effects EVERYONE.
Yea I never understood that either. The flag represents freedom and part of that freedom is the right to protest, so in essence, you’re honoring what the flag stands for by expressing your right to protest. You don’t have to agree with the message (I don’t know how anyone could be against racial injustice or deny that there is a problem) but it is their right to protest. These dopes will talk about veterans fighting for our freedom, well, this is part of that freedom don’t forget that, hypocrites. My advice to these people is to stfu and listen.
Also Drew Brees recently caused a shit storm. There are white people out there who are so tone deaf to the situation here. Brees who’s shared a locker room with blacks his entire life still doesn’t get it, he probably never will. When people are willfully ignorant there is no saving them, they sorta have to save themselves if and when that ever happens.
I look forward to your rebuttal.