I don’t remember. Grumpy probably remembers the exact dialogue since he was wetting himself with excitement.
Paul’s a nice guy and was like super politically correct and reserved with his conversations with everyone. That’s great and all, but it’s pretty hard to actually get a reading on what he thinks about certain stuff.
As I was watching / listening to him chat with a couple other people I could tell there were a few times when he really just wanted the other person to go away or drop dead of heart failure but he’s not the type of guy to just say, “Yeah, that’s boring, can you go stand over there and never talk to me again?” and he soldiers on appropriately.
Maybe if we could get him liquored up or something and get him all wound up we can finally get him to drop some dirt on people. It wasn’t happening that night, though.
Grumpy asked Paul about “Dark Side” at the “Fix” premiere and said he thought it was mostly Paul’s work as opposed to Al’s or a collaborative effort and he was mumbling some G-rated babble about it, and I just told him, “Look, Man! Al says he doesn’t remember making it, so you may as well take all the credit for it!”
This is true. he was very humble about the record and that it was equal parts both of them together making the record. Fucking Barker, class act all the way through. I could see DSOTS being a full on Pink Anvil record but then Al came in and put his own tweak on it. Which is just perfection between the 2 of them. I had actually forgotten about asking him that. way to remember Homie.
Late,
grmpysmrf
I don’t remember. Grumpy probably remembers the exact dialogue since he was wetting himself with excitement.
Paul’s a nice guy and was like super politically correct and reserved with his conversations with everyone. That’s great and all, but it’s pretty hard to actually get a reading on what he thinks about certain stuff.
As I was watching / listening to him chat with a couple other people I could tell there were a few times when he really just wanted the other person to go away or drop dead of heart failure but he’s not the type of guy to just say, “Yeah, that’s boring, can you go stand over there and never talk to me again?” and he soldiers on appropriately.
Maybe if we could get him liquored up or something and get him all wound up we can finally get him to drop some dirt on people. It wasn’t happening that night, though.[/reply]
that’s exactly why i love paul. that and, you know, the fact that he’s a musical genius. i don’t drink, but i’d LOVE to get drunk with paul.
I read an interview with Al around the time dsots came out and he explained how he mixed together the saxophone player who played all the complicated sax parts and his own playing which was obviously crap but to great affect on Nursing Home. I can’t find any info on that again on the net - I’m sure it was Roland Barker playing the session player level of sax but can’t find anything so could be wrong, but there was definitely someone else also playing sax. Maybe this isn’t mentioned much because of the Mingus sample in 10/10? No idea ha.
I don’t think that album is technically more Paul than Al - lots of other players are credited with writing on all the songs too. I reckon Al/Paul wise it’s not much different from Filth Pig. Maybe the scrapped album was mainly Paul - would like to hear it anyway, sounds like a lost album between dsots and fp maybe?
Great album, one of my faves. only bit I don’t like much is Bad Blood, just doesn’t fit on it and ruins the flow/atmosphere. it just sort of plods along.
Let’s say Ministry were dropped by Warners after Filth Pig due to poor sales, and they started 13th Planet in 1996.
Would DSOTS have been made, or would they have churned out another Psalm 69 since they didn’t have the security of a major label?
Could DSOTS only have been made because they had Warners behind them? And is this the reason every album that has come out since has been billed by Al as “Psalm 70…our most aggressive yet”?
Let’s say Ministry were dropped by Warners after Filth Pig due to poor sales, and they started 13th Planet in 1996.
Would DSOTS have been made, or would they have churned out another Psalm 69 since they didn’t have the security of a major label?
Could DSOTS only have been made because they had Warners behind them? And is this the reason every album that has come out since has been billed by Al as “Psalm 70…our most aggressive yet”?
Let’s say Ministry were dropped by Warners after Filth Pig due to poor sales, and they started 13th Planet in 1996.
Would DSOTS have been made, or would they have churned out another Psalm 69 since they didn’t have the security of a major label?
Could DSOTS only have been made because they had Warners behind them? And is this the reason every album that has come out since has been billed by Al as “Psalm 70…our most aggressive yet”?
I don’t think being on Warner Bros is the reason DSOTS was made and not another “Psalm 70”. I think Paul being in the band is what thankfully prevented the releases of the “harder, faster, heavier, more aggressive!!!” Psalm 69 rehashes.
Yeah, if anything warner brothers would want a another psalm 69. They know it would sell, which means more $ for them. If anything dsots was made in order to get dropped from the label.
Late,
grmpysmrf
I don’t think being on Warner Bros is the reason DSOTS was made and not another “Psalm 70”. I think Paul being in the band is what thankfully prevented the releases of the “harder, faster, heavier, more aggressive!!!” Psalm 69 rehashes.
I don’t know about that. In 2003 Al was comparing Animositisomina to Psalm 69, that was sort of when the whole thing started. Honestly, I think Paul left because he probably realized the band was spent at that point.
I think Dark Side was made as sort of a way to sum up their career. Filth Pig and Dark Side both have parts with natural vocals and song structures that represent the early years, Supermanic Soul has a Psalm 69 feel, Whip and Chain resembles Twitch, some of the experimental stuff nods back to LORAH, etc.
I totally agree that it was Warners money that helped create DTotS. Their old style of music making (I.e. holing up in a studio for years working on it) couldn’t be supported without big bucks behind them. It’s why animositoastedsamosa sounds so less rich than Dark Side.
I guess the only difference is the fact that WB may have put more into funding their “studio time” and the long periods between albums.
DSOTS is not the sort of album you make on a major label and that’s one of the many reasons it stands out to me. It shows how uncompromising they were at the time. Instead of making the album a lot of people wanted after the supposed disappointment with Filth Pig, they pushed it even further away.
I don’t think they would have made another Psalm 69 if they’d been kicked after FP. DSOTS seems like it was the only album they could’ve made at that point in time.
Yeah, if anything warner brothers would want a another psalm 69. They know it would sell, which means more $ for them. If anything dsots was made in order to get dropped from the label.
Late,
grmpysmrf
Exactly. WB would’ve been much happier had the band made another Psalm 69.
I would think Dark Side is what it is because of who was involved in the album but also Al’s state which was perfect for fucked up brilliant music. I would be skeptical of Paul basically running the whole thing himself, largely on the basis that his solo stuff is markedly a league below that of FP and Dark Side.
Not sure about the Warner contract permitting them to make Dark Side and that without that it would not have been made. Production quality wise, could be the case that it would have sounded weaker if it was made with less money - the way Animo sounds of a lesser standard than the preceding two albums. But the ability to make that type of album depends more on the direction and headspace of the artists involved.
Warner certainly would have preferred a Psalm-like album. They were dying to get rid of Ministry
I read an interview with Al around the time dsots came out and he explained how he mixed together the saxophone player who played all the complicated sax parts and his own playing which was obviously crap but to great affect on Nursing Home. I can’t find any info on that again on the net - I’m sure it was Roland Barker playing the session player level of sax but can’t find anything so could be wrong, but there was definitely someone else also playing sax. Maybe this isn’t mentioned much because of the Mingus sample in 10/10? No idea ha.
I would be skeptical of Paul basically running the whole thing himself, largely on the basis that his solo stuff is markedly a league below that of FP and Dark Side.
Yeah but what would it sound like if there was a little bit of al thrown in there? His solo stuff, while not up to snuff as FP & DSOTS, still has the same feeling/atmosphere/vibe as FP and DSOTS.
Late,
grmpysmrf
[reply]I read an interview with Al around the time dsots came out and he explained how he mixed together the saxophone player who played all the complicated sax parts and his own playing which was obviously crap but to great affect on Nursing Home. I can’t find any info on that again on the net - I’m sure it was Roland Barker playing the session player level of sax but can’t find anything so could be wrong, but there was definitely someone else also playing sax. Maybe this isn’t mentioned much because of the Mingus sample in 10/10? No idea ha.
Then why was Al credited on sax?[/reply]
because he played sax. I mentioned it in my post. the squeaky horrible parts were Al, the accomplished sax parts were someone else. Al edited the two together. In regards to Nursing Home anyway. sounds good.
websites like discogs and wiki are often wrong (or incomplete) on credits, so are album inlays for many reasons. I like to know what each musician played and wrote on albums, and this sticks in my mind because Al mentioned this in an interview around the time.
I also talked to Paul about that album at my FIX premier in NYC. I didn’t specifically ask if it was “his” album or anything, but I just said I am a huge fan of DSOTS, I think it’s brilliant, etc. and he seemed really, genuinely pleased about that. I can tell he really does like that record and is proud of it. I even told him my band was called “Nursing Home” (named partially after the song) and he was like “that’s a great band name!”
Regarding the record being “Paul’s record”, I will second the opinion that that’s a load of crap. I agree that Flowering Blight is nowhere near as good as DSOTS and I think there is Al written all over the record as well. If anything I think it was a fusion of people involved, but Paul certainly played a big part.
When Al says he doesn’t remember, I think it’s probably true for the most part, but it doesn’t imply that he didn’t do anything and Paul just took over.
Also yes the drop in production quality with ‘Animositisomina’ probably does have to do with them being dropped from Warner Bros. Yes they had their own studio but I think Warner supplied them the budget to get techs in there who knew what the fuck they were doing because ‘Animositisomina’ was a big drop in production quality and nothing else really explains that…
I think ‘Animositisomina’ would have been much better produced had they had the resources that Warner provided…
And because of what I just said I don’t believe that DSOTS was an attempt to get dropped from Warner, or if it was they must have realized quickly that they’d made a mistake because the promotion for ‘Animositisomina’ was all about “the continuation of Psalm 69” sound. That may have been Sanctuary’s doing but Al definitely echoed that sentiment. I think if they were trying to get dropped from Warner they probably realized pretty quick “fuck we need money to run this whole show on our own…”
It seems like a classic case where the kid is rebelling “fuck you mom I’m gonna go do drugs!!” and then mom finally wises up and says “ok go do it” and the kid goes out, has a bad scare, and realizes maybe that level freedom wasn’t so great after all…
In short DSOTS seems like a big “fuck you” to the fans that could only have happened with the cushion of a major label under their asses. They couldn’t have possibly thought it was going to succeed where Filth Pig “failed”…
I don’t think DSOTS was a “fuck you” to the fans at all. That takes away from the album and any genuine emotion or honesty that was put into making it. I’d like to believe it meant a bit more to them than that.
I think it was the only album they could have made at that point in time and was the album they wanted to make. This idea that DSOTS could have only been made while they were on a major label is ridiculous. It is far too tedious and is almost completely lacking any commercial singles. One of the many things that makes it awesome is the fact that they made it while on a major label - especially after FP.
I don’t think it was all Paul but I do think he had a larger role on the album or at the very least a larger role than he had on some of the past albums.
It seems like a classic case where the kid is rebelling “fuck you mom I’m gonna go do drugs!!” and then mom finally wises up and says “ok go do it” and the kid goes out, has a bad scare, and realizes maybe that level freedom wasn’t so great after all…
Yeah, because that’s totally common and falls directly under the category of “Classic Cases”.