C. Clouser (nin) funny letter

Discussion
1

This is the old (2006) legendary letter from charlie clouser (nin live keyboardist 95-02,prgms white/rob zombie,prong,the downward spiral,alec empire,saw soundtracks) to jerome dillon (nin drummer 99-05) after dillon was let go because of health problems and made a huge stink about it on-line. Trent even posted on a few boards putting the smack down. I read it then and just stumbled on it again it’s fuckin’ hilarious thought i’d share for nin fans.
Here yah go:

Good Lord, I would have thought these kids had grown up by now! You hear how TR and Jayrome going off on each other, it’s like “whaaaahhh whaaahhh!”. Fuck.
First off, TR don’t owe me SHIT. I don’t feel like I’ve been wronged or got a raw deal out of NIN, I motherfucking SCORED being in that band.
As did we all, as did we all…
It’s been five years since I’m out, so, okay, you guys want the straight dope, here it is. (deep breath)
To Jay-rome…
Jay-rome, bro, dude… You’re a great drummer. That’s cool. You might have made a really interesting record (ain’t heard it yet), which is even cooler.
But, hello, ummm… how well do you know TR, anyway? Does any of this surprise you, bro? Do you remember how it went down when various other people left the band? Weren’t you there the day I left, when TR found a few things of mine still in the studio, and threw them in the freaking dumpster while I’m standing right there by my car? IN THE DUMPSTER? And all I did was shake my head and say to myself, “dude has got some issues…”
Remember, this was after I cowrote, remixed, and programmed way more shit than you ever did. Remember, I also made the live tapes? I also did the remixes on FDTS. I also programmed shit on TDS and The Fragile. I also brought Starfuckers, Inc. to the table, remember? That ain’t no motherfucking bassline, fool, that’s my QuasiMidi Rave-O-Lution 309 beatbox! AND those vocal fx dawg.
My reaction: “Whatever, dude. I’m out. Later for you and your harshness.”
You didn’t see how he fucking shut Chris Vrenna down. Goddamn motherfucking PodBoy had been with TR since the ramen-noodle years, running down to CompUSA every week to buy TR more video games, sitting there reading from the cheats book while TR played Doom for hours, never giving Pod a chance to play, and fucking sitting in the driver’s seat in the studio for more than ten years. At the end of that decade, while TR is buying a fucking man$ion, he was paying Pod like $60k. All Pod wanted was a little piece of the action to go along with his salary. Like a fucking nickel off the net dollar on swag. Like maybe a point on the record. No fucking way, TR and Malm told Pod that he was now ‘surplus to requirements’ and put his ass in the wind. After TEN FUCKING YEARS! Pod is the one who should bitch, not you. Pod is the one that should have been singin’, “We built this city on rock 'n roll, and all I got was this lousy T-shirt!”.
So you wonder why he didn’t call you in the hospital? Fuck, dude… TR needs to watch out for TR and the rest of you can take a flying fuck at a rolling donut, and you’re just now figuring this out? You thought that since you two were best butt-buddies for a while, that you guys were gonna be bros in later years?
You’re lucky they didn’t pull your luggage off the bus and drop it at the hospital!
Dude, everyone who’s ever been in NIN or worked for (there is no WITH) Trent has been butt-buddy at some point. We all rode shotgun in his green porsche while he talked the big talk, and we all believed it, some for longer than others.
The only reason I ever moved to NOLA was because TR told me, straight up, that he wanted me and danny to write the tracks for a Tapeworm album, on which I would get a production credit.
This was in 1995. NINETEEN NINETY FUCKING FIVE, DUDE!
Remember, I was just starting to write the first Rob Zombie album, when TR conned me into moving to NOLA on the basis of Tapeworm. I was living in 7200 square feet in Nichols Canyon, with the protools rigs of doom. My game was ALREADY TIGHT nucca.
I took a pretty major pay cut to join NIN, and the only reason was because of the fantasy Tapeworm bonus. We knew it was never going to happen years before you showed up. It became a big joke for me and Danny (but not a very funny one). Robin never believed that shit for a second, he was out of there right after the tour ended.
So, after all this, you get to say, “I used to be in nine inch nails.” Isn’t that enough for you? That ought to be worth something, yeah? Work that shit, homey, but don’t you ever try to hold TR to his word on fantasy shit like Tapeworm or “I’ll produce your record…”
He’s the guy that invites you over for a bbq and gets all sullen when you take two hamburgers instead of one, but don’t let it get to you. Eat both of ‘em! Fuckit!
But here’s the moral of this harsh story:
The important part now is to not become like him.
Shake it off, man. Deep breath. You fucking carry that bitterness for TR with you thru life, man, you will poison yourself from the inside. TR always claiming he’s dark, he got a black soul, saying shit like “you know me, I hate EVERYONE!”
Ooooohhh ain’t he tuff. SuperTuff. SuperDuperTuff. He so motherfuckin dark he make you look light by comparison, nucca.
Well, what if all that shit he claimin’ is actually TRUE? What if he really IS that hateful person that he describes in all them dark lyrics? If he IS that guy, then he needs his head examined or removed ASAP. Man, forget that shit as soon as you can. People get what they deserve in the end, man, they reap what they sow. They get the kind of freinds they deserve.
Remember how record labels would call Nothing Records or Conservative Management looking to get me to do a remix, and Malm would make sure I never got the message? I found out about all that shit when I got back to LA, how all these fools be like, “Where you been? We been leaving messages at Nothing Records for like two years! They wouldn’t give us your number, or the number at the studio in NOLA, so WTF is up with that?” And I’m like, “John MotherFucking Malm is what’s up with that.”
So yeah, I got fired out of there on zero notice. TR put my sorry ass in the wind too.
And I don’t look back.
Would I do it all over again? Yeah, but I would have been right behind Robin on the way back to LA instead of waiting four more years for shit that wasn’t ever gonna happen. That last tour we did was a joke, and you know it. Fucking TR forgetting lyrics onstage, Robin taking a swing at TR in Australia, shit I was ready to walk off stage and take a cab to the airport that one time in Japan when he just lying on stage drunk off his ass mumbling instead of singing.
Now he all on ‘roid rage, he could snap me like a twig, but back then was a different story. Remember that Japanese chick with the missing teeth when we went to the temples in Kyoto? Fuck.
How many people can you name who would honestly say that they think TR has been a real friend across the years? Some of his high school buddies that come out on tour, or Clint, maybe, but that’s cause they never really “worked” together. I saw Clint coming out of the dressing room at the Bowl smiling, so they obviously all good, but I wasn’t even allowed to say hi to TR. I got the blockade from security! Hahahahah LoLLerskates HUGZ ROFL ain’t that some shit?
All’s I wanted to say was, “congrats on the new album, new tour, and new YOU! TR, you look TIGHT and your game is seriously ON, man, and I am psyched for you. You obviously conquered some heavy shit, and you gotta feel good, yeah?” Not like I’m gonna complain about shit from five years ago backstage, right?
Hey also, didn’t I hear TR talking some shit about how he 12-stepped his way back to planet earth? Well, I ain’t never 12-stepped myself, but I got a couple close friends who did, and the one thing they all said was part of the process was to go back and apologize or make amends with all who were hurt by your actions while you were under the influence of whatever you’re 12-stepping out of.
Did TR ever drop one motherfucking dime? PodBoy never got that call. I know you didn’t get that call… I didn’t need one, since I played his ass right back as he was playing mine, but PodBoy got the short end of the long stick. Well, maybe he only made it through 11 out of the 12 steps… but I don’t know nothing about 12 steps. (oh yeah, I am clean, but it only took one step.)
(BTW: You’re better off not being in a band that plays medleys…)
Now, before y’all go thinking I feel all “wronged” by TR, I don’t. I am absolutely fine with him. I sussed the deal soon enough, and it WAS a cushy situation, so I let it ride for a while, and I hung around while I got my act together to re-enter LA. Soon as I felt like he was short-changin’ me, I said, “Shit, I gotta get me a night job!” Had to finish the demos for the Helmet album while still on TR’s payroll, ya unnerstand? So I managed to extract value from the transaction, even if it wasn’t the value I thought going in. So we cool, I know he threw my shit in the dumpster cause I was writing Helmet and remixing Zombie on his dime, but shit, man, the way I deal is to say, “don’t be motherfucking remixing Zombie on my dime bitch!” right to a sucker’s face instead of throwing they shit in the dumpster, run back in the studio, and change the locks.
So TR, I know you gonna see this, and hate on me, and it’s cool. I know you gonna whip out the pics of me and Lifto and the carrot, or video of my “initiation” backstage in Long Island, or some other embarrassing shit. Bring it, I don’t give a fuck. I got no probs with you dude and you can diss me all you want. I’m happy for ya man, you making it work big time. Plus, you’re mr. artistic integrity guy, and I do cheesy horror movies, so who the fuck am I?
So you got it all over me, yeah. I ain’t on your level, and I ain’t never gonna BE on your level.
And all was right and as it should be in the world…
And I am OUT. Later.

aha ha btw he’s a fucking programing super-hero so his ‘comptan’ speak is part of him being hilarious and a smart ass that’s what makes it great btw heres the show with the robin fight http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyWmDd9eKog (also notice drunk TR and the he was like
“dude your turn to sing…dude…dude dude dude” part with robin
This one he fall’s on his face it funny as fuck at the first verse of march…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWQUldTdCYU
the first six seconds is worth it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvRweIqYdp8&feature=related
Don’t get me wrong i love trent and until i saw this (which is kinda sad) I missed old ‘selfdestruct’ nails but now i see with these drunk trent videos , sober nin is actually better. Also i’m not making fun of the guy’s addiction issues either i’ve made an ass of myself plenty of times just not on stage/you tube. Makes me think of al’s ‘step’ song

2

This might amuse me more if the only NIN album I REALLY liked wasn’t Pretty Hate Machine.

Still, good stuff.

3

I started reading and didn’t get bored.

List of industretards:

Jourgenson,
Manson,
Reznor,
Zombie (if he can be considered industrial…),
Atkins,
and I hear good ol’ Gen-P’s tread on more than just his fair share of toes (including Genesse and Caresse… only going by a few bitter youtube comments, tho…)

4

This might amuse me more if the only NIN album I REALLY liked wasn’t Pretty Hate Machine.

Still, good stuff.

I knew there was just more than me!
Late,
grmpysmrf

5

That was a great read, thanks for posting. Best line: ‘That ain’t no motherfucking bassline, fool, that’s my QuasiMidi Rave-O-Lution 309 beatbox!’

I didn’t realise Clouser was this kind of character but then again I didn’t know anything about him I just keep seeing his name pop up all over the place.

6

pretty hate machine aye? I dunno it’s a good record and all (i just listened to it) but my heart is with ‘broken’ as i picked that and later psalm 69 up at…wal-mart (yep) in my hick town at the time in '92 i was 12 and broken was the first ‘rock’ record i ever owned. I could’nt get into phm as it dealt mostly with relationship issues i could not relate to at 12-13 but i could understand the full-on anger and self-loathing rage of broken perfect for those budding teen-angst years

7

He says “bro” a lot, which means the whole thing reads better in Hulk Hogan’s voice.

8

I’m not totally sure but im pretty sure the “Bro” talk was just him messing around. In all the interviews i have seen with him he never really speaks like that.

9

I found this hilarious when I first read it like a year or so ago. Quite revealing/depressing as well.

I think most of my heroes are douchebags though and it’s not really too surprising (TR, Manson, Al Jourgensen etc.) considering I myself am a dick.

10

Don’t do drugs kids.

11

the vid of march of the pigs in japan is just classic youtube. i think CC was a bit tounge in cheek with all the bro’s and nigga’s (this was i think when trent was doing hip hop with saul) because he was making fun of trent speak.
I do feel bad for podboy though. But he’s in manson now which probably made treent shit a brick.
it’s weird how you read interviews and shit like this and piece things together on who your “idols” really are as people, granted it’s all to be taken with a grain of salt.
kinda makes you think of those comments manson made about podboy having lots of dirt on trent and how he got dicked over by him but took the high road and never said a word… and then how manson wanted to remaster POAAF but the original tapes are supposedly MIA.

I think robin lasted till the end there because he pretty much KNEW he was just a hired hand. Tour ends, he moves on to the circus, or GNR or whatever… tour time comes and he’s back.

12

kinda makes you think of those comments manson made about podboy having lots of dirt on trent and how he got dicked over by him but took the high road and never said a word… and then how manson wanted to remaster POAAF but the original tapes are supposedly MIA.

I think you mean ‘Antichrist Superstar’ but yeah it‘s pretty obvious Trent is keeping the masters locked up which is fucked in my opinion. He already made a lot of $ off Manson and is still collecting royalties he should just let it go.

I doubt Trent cares or was surprised Vrenna joined Manson though. If anything it would have been much more painful for MM when Twiggy joined NIN (where he too was treated like shit supposedly)

But I think Trent really is a big douche. Esp when in interviews he is saying shit like this:

"In a recent interview with Mojo magazine, Trent Reznor had some less-than-kind words to say about Marilyn Manson.

“He is a malicious guy and will step on anybody’s face to succeed and cross any line of decency,” Reznor says. “Seeing him now, drugs and alcohol now rule his life and he’s become a dopey clown.”

“He used to be the smartest guy in the room,” Reznor said. “And as a fan of his talents, I hope he gets his shit together.”

Trent has been calling out a lot of musicians publicly lately though, even publicly slamming hitmakers like Prince and Weezer’s Rivers Cuomo.

“I’m not Prince or Rivers Cuomo, who brags about having hundreds of great songs,” Reznor said. “And to that I would say, ‘Prince, if you have a hundred great songs or a thousand, how about picking a few and putting them on your record that you’ve put out, because your last several have sucked.’ Same for you, Rivers. I say that constructively, you know.”"

If you want to help someone or genuinely care about them, that is the LAST way you go about it. Typical holier-than-thou AA graduate…

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no it was POAAF… don’t forget that it came out on nothing records…
but what trent said IS basically true. when does manson not mention drugs in an interview, being high, basically how it’s his job to be high, and then he usually has a juvenille threat like “and if you disagree I’ll cut you”.

there’s definately a difference in how his interviews go. I got those old daydream milk and genocide manson fanzine’s where it’s all reprints of interviews with the band, and reading those old articles and something recent is like night and day.

trent did alot of shit talking this year, but then he goes and did that thing to get money for that one fan who was in the hospital on the nin/ja tour.

i think all he said about weezer and pprince was they are capable of doing better music. remember prince was an inspiration for trent during his making of PHM. he’d talk about how he read prince worked in a studio to get time when it wasn’t used to do his work and playing everything himself. and honestly that prince cd that came out from target was only really 1 really good cd, a mediocre cd with 2 good tracks, and a cd on some new protege that was unnecessary

14

He also expressed his disappointment in Chris Cornell. I wouldn’t done that myself, also. From what I understand. Trent pre-2000 was a real hassle to be around and work with. The stuff with Dillion seemed like it went both ways. I was under the impression that he quit, rather than get fired. He started the trading of blows with Reznor, reznor fired back, clouser did his thing, and that was that.

Vrenna probably did get shafted the most out of all of them. But the way it looked with Dillion. He had a few health issues, but in actuality, he started flaking out I think and quit mid-tour which left Trent having to search for a new drummer during the tour. Trent’s not an idiot to just fire a drummer mid-tour and just continue the way he did.

15

Seems like Voidhead loves douchey behavior/comments when done by someone who is drunk/fucked up but doesn’t enjoy the same when it’s done by a sober person.

16

no it was POAAF… don’t forget that it came out on nothing records…

http://www.marilynmanson.com/news.php?newsid=125

Have you considered re-releasing any of your older albums with remastered tracks, b-sides, and other goodies? Antichrist Superstar turns ten years old next year. Is there any possibility of fans getting to hear an improved mix of this milestone album in the future?

I’d like to say yes, but there’s a legal matter pending that I can’t say too much about. It’s very hard to believe this, but representatives from Nothing Records have indicated that they are not able to find, or have lost the master recordings to my first three records. It’s not something that you would ever let happen in musical history. I would imagine something like that could only be intentional. If not intentional, it would have to be done only through complete disregard. Now that Nothing Records doesn’t exist, I think there’s only one of two people responsible for that. Out of those two people, there’s only one that really has an opinion of me that is voiced very often.

17

When we had Vrenna come to Neo to DJ one night (Manson showed up), on Feb 5 08, I asked him a bit about working with TR. Vrenna didn’t say much and shrugged it off but I could tell he was hurt by his dealings with TR. He did not speak ill of anyone though. I spoke briefly to Manson too that night but didn’t want to ruin his night of mentioning anything along those lines…

It’s a very comparable situation to Ministry if you think about it.

18

seems alot of these “industrial” bands become a cult of personality of sorts.

19

Something i read about C.vrenna’s drumming from self-destruct tour etc. apparently they’re all triggered even the toms and various acoustic parts of the kit. He would sample, for instance, the ‘live’ drum sound from ‘march of the pigs’ and play it through triggers…on a live kit…live (apparently the cymbals/hi-hat were the only thing without triggers) which seems kinda odd but they wanted the sound of each individual song (drum wise) to be true to the record. Chris and Bill R. were two of the most interesting drummers of the 90’s (they seemed amazing and alien) i thought at the time esp. Chris but it turns out alot of that sound was either triggered or pre-recorded ‘live’ drum loops kind of a let down for me, but explains alot of the different live sound (less ‘industrial’ as it was) nails had after c.v. left. I figured since a lot of us make music here, it would be interesting info.[;)]

P.S. As far as people who look up to manson and call trent a douche
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pe46RUN-mM&feature=related
yeah cause he did’nt start the song fast enough. And this :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CL9AhJO2CKI&NR=1
i wish he would have clocked that dumb fuck esp. since j5 is an awesome gtr player and gen. nice guy as it seems. At least when old nin broke instruments or,er-um, fell on there faces mid song they looked classy

20

I have to admit.

The punching on on-stage is pretty cool.

I saw the Brian Jonestown Massacre recently in Melbourne.

The verbal barrage Anton put his entire band through in front of everyone on stage was devastating; entertaining.

Yet, I think it was nothing but a massive put on.

I mean…

I reckon the Manson thing was a put on too… seriously, he didn’t clock him back. All for show.