The (Un)Official Ministry Album Tier List

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Totally agreed. I absolutely LOVE that about “Spoon”. Someone posed the topic some years back asking whether “Filth Pig” or “Spoon” was the darker album and there just ain’t any comparison.

“Spoon” is like a window into the blackest part of someone’s soul. I’m not talking about that cheesy blackmetal crap, either. This album, to me, is the most HONEST of any albums I’ve ever heard. It’s so raw and brutal. It is just a really sick journey.

And it is so cynical, negative, and jaded. Whereas there are dark subjects on other records there also seems to be a glimmer of humor or hope or some sort of joy dispersed amongst everything. This album . . . . even when there are “jokes” they’re not jokes to be fun or cheer people up, they’re angry pissed off old man jokes. Like stuff that your hateful 90 year old dying grandpa screams at kids from his yard because he truly wants the kids to suffer like his old broken ass is suffering.

There’s a a desperation to that album that is hard to describe. The atmosphere is very thick with this disc. It’s not a feel good record, but it definitely makes you FEEL. I like to listen to this one when I can be alone and just drink some wine or something.

The other thing I love about this album is that, although it is really dark and nasty, there’s also a junkie sexiness to it that I find really irresistable. It’s that Sid and Nancy, rock bottom, sold-our-soul-to-the-devil, type of sexiness that comes with hitting a point of addiction that descends into complete degeneracy.

Al is not even a human on this record. He’s something further evolved via self-destruction. He’s like some alien mutant demon creature screaming from the other side of the door to Hell. I saw him on both this tour and the Filth Pig tour and I can tell you that he was truly frightening. It was like coming face to face with pure evil. And the vibe that creates in a club is pure magic.

Okay, enough jerking off for now . . . I just REALLY REALLY love Junkie Al and miss him. Yes, I’m glad he’s off the junk and do ultimately wish the best for him, but I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. Al and Heroin are like peanut butter and chocolate. Put one in the other and you’re gonna get something delicious.

Don’t forget about Twitched.

It was a semi official bootleg but was meant to be how the album was originally meant to be represented.

Sire records forced the band to include ‘All Day’ on the official release supposedly.

I’m not as crafty as you are Ice, but I’ll attempt to do mine via text. I’ll also list the faults, and to be fair, they all have them.

TIER 1 (Top/First Place Group)
The Land of Rape And Honey (The first 3 tracks set the blueprint for the future of Ministry and sound a bit out of place as the rest of the album sort of does its own thing. That isn’t a bad thing at all in my book.)

Twitch (Where You At Now and Crash & Burn are a bit too long)

Filth Pig (Useless and Crumbs are not as strong as the other songs, but they still get a thumbs up)

The Mind Is A Terrible Thing To Taste (Test is unique, but not really that good. Faith Collapsing sounds cool, but isn’t a strong track. Never Believe goes on a bit long.)

TIER 2 (Top/Second Place Group)
With Sympathy (The early/live versions of some songs are better than what is presented on the album. The newly recorded songs are good, but I would have preferred polished versions of some other songs. This would have made it to TEIR 1 if it had been developed to its full potential )

Psalm 69 (To me this is a catchier version of what they were going with on TMIATTTT and in that sense, isn’t as innovative/different. The majority of the songs are strong, but the last two noise/filler tracks aren’t anything special.)

Early Trax/12" Singles (All of the songs are excellent, but both compilations exclude material. Not really an album, I know, but it is an important step between WS and Twitch)

TIER 3 (Mostly Good/Okay)
Dark Side Of The Spoon (Supermanic Soul screams rehash. 10/10 and Linda Summertime are unique, but not noteworthy. The rest of the songs range from okay to awesome.)

Relapse (The music is excellent and really shines. The only thing that drags it down are the lyrics)

Animositisomina (Some good material here, but it sounds like it is standing in the shadow of all the previous Ministry albums. It isn’t something that sticks out in the catalog.)

TIER 4 (AKA I wouldn’t have bought these if they weren’t Ministry)

(These albums have a few good tracks on each and several just “ok” songs. They all sound like the same record to me and while they are enjoyable at times, they get really old after awhile)
Rio Grande Blood
Last Sucker
Houses of the Mole

Totally agree Gunar. It’s as dark as I’ve heard Ministry and maybe that is a “fault”. I don’t know because that’s always felt like its strength to me.

The thing that’s frightening about the album is that it does not sound like it’s trying to be dark at all. But there was just no hiding it and no other way, I guess. There’s “joke” songs and slightly “playful” songs… there’s a fucking banjo… but it sounds like it all came out of the mind(s) of a madman/madmen whose humor is skewed and fucked. Like there’s no hiding the low Al and possibly Paul were in. It feels like nothing is held back and that it was impossible to hide it.

When I first heard it I like it immediately because, well, I liked the songs, and because it felt genuinely hopeless and insane.

[reply][reply]what are these faults people speak of? i love the sound of that record; it’s what makes it so unique.

We’re talking about DSOTS, right? If so, even though it’s my favorite album by the band, I can completely understand why some people wouldn’t like it. It’s not easy to listen to and it’s not the typical guitar heavy metal shit a lot of people wanted (which is why many even dislike(d) Filth Pig).

It’s pretty fucking dark and claustrophobic. And it gives off a vibe that, to me, no other Ministry album does. Even the “joke” songs sound psychotic and a little sinister. I always thought it was successful in conveying through words and sounds someone completely losing their mind and hitting bottom - regardless of whether or not that was the band’s intention.

All of these are reasons why I love the album though. That and it has “Eureka Pile”. Which is, in my opinion, one of the best songs they’ve written and is completely underrated (then again the whole album is severely underrated).[/reply]

lol agree with everything you said…but my questions still remains! everything you listed were strengths, not faults.[/reply]

My bad. I suppose I can’t think of any actual “faults” as it’s all based on opinion anyway. I would LOVE to hear someone who feels that the album has legitimate faults, or even sucks, to explain what they are. I suppose it drags a bit towards the end? But when you listen to it as a complete album it flows really well and that drag towards the end is fitting in that it drags you down with it.

Gunnar nailed it…DSOTS has it all…junkie sax,dub rhythms,twisted banjo,off kilter weirdness at every turn,the feeling the entire thing can become unhinged at any moment,Eastern-tinged vocals,great songs,sick lyrics…this album,along with Filth Pig hold special places in my heart…I loved them when they were unpopular and I still do til this day…

I think Houses of the Mole is distinctive from the other 2 Bush trilogy records…I love Houses…it has an incredible energy to it and is catchy and fun…

My desert island Ministry records would probably be(in no order):

1)Filth Pig
2)DSOTS
3)Animositosomina
4)Psalm 69
5)Mind

special mention:
Houses of Mole/ICYDFLSU

Desert Island Discs? HAHAHA!!! Is this PULSE Magazine?

Okay, fine . . . .

ICYDFLSU
Filth Pig
Dark Side of the Spoon
Psalm 69
Relapse

Runners up: Houses of the Mole, Twitch

Haha yeah that was kinda faggy of me…

Haha yeah that was kinda faggy of me…

That was always like the only part of the magazine I ever looked at consistently. And I was always like, “Hmmm, this guy seems pretty cool! But this dude? What a douche! Oh, damn, this chick likes DEVO! Where’s she live?”

If I met a chick who liked Devo I would marry her instantly…

If I met a chick who liked Devo I would marry her instantly…

I know, right? It’s like, what else would you possibly need to know about her? Uhh, nothing.

You know Gunnar, the way you describe Dark Side kinda sounds like what Trent intended The Downward Spiral to be. Except that he failed in comparison. I think I’ve said this before, but I always felt that there was a concept to Dark Side. I guess that reiterates Gunnar saying it makes you feel. I always visioned the album being a man’s (we’ll just say Al’s) last time doing heroin. I’ll even break it down track by track.

Supermanic Soul is a drug deal gone bad. For me the opening line of “I just shot a man to death” just says it all. Whip & Chain is Al having a battle with his conscience. Like having the angel on one shoulder and the devil on the other. He knows the angel is right, but he’s a junkie who must satisfy his fix. Bad Blood is him resisting the urge which causes him to fix even worse. Eureka Pile is him giving up and the beginning of the craziest high he’s ever had. Step is building towards insanity, kind of like a crazy car chase, and Nursing Home is losing the grip of reality. Kaif and Vex & Siolence are the come down songs, with the former having that initial shit feeling and the conclusion of the latter of needing to shoot up again. But the shit feeling is so powerful that he decides he’s had enough. So 10/10 is Al overdosing and not coming back. In other words, his life flashing before his eyes. Finally, the album ends with Linda Summertime with Al reaching the other side. I’ve never really thought of if he’s in heaven or hell. All I really see is black while this plays.

And that’s why that is one of the greatest albums of all time. I good you bid evening.

what are these faults people speak of?

The only fault with DSOTS as far as I’m concerned is it never got a vinyl pressing. That album is brilliant…tunes like Eureka Pile and Nursing Home are JAMMIN!!! Then you have scorchers like Supermanic Soul. Ministry at their most experimental…you could tell they were totally jamming to create a lot of those tunes.

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Totally agreed. I absolutely LOVE that about “Spoon”. Someone posed the topic some years back asking whether “Filth Pig” or “Spoon” was the darker album and there just ain’t any comparison.

“Spoon” is like a window into the blackest part of someone’s soul. I’m not talking about that cheesy blackmetal crap, either. This album, to me, is the most HONEST of any albums I’ve ever heard. It’s so raw and brutal. It is just a really sick journey.

And it is so cynical, negative, and jaded. Whereas there are dark subjects on other records there also seems to be a glimmer of humor or hope or some sort of joy dispersed amongst everything. This album . . . . even when there are “jokes” they’re not jokes to be fun or cheer people up, they’re angry pissed off old man jokes. Like stuff that your hateful 90 year old dying grandpa screams at kids from his yard because he truly wants the kids to suffer like his old broken ass is suffering.

There’s a a desperation to that album that is hard to describe. The atmosphere is very thick with this disc. It’s not a feel good record, but it definitely makes you FEEL. I like to listen to this one when I can be alone and just drink some wine or something.

The other thing I love about this album is that, although it is really dark and nasty, there’s also a junkie sexiness to it that I find really irresistable. It’s that Sid and Nancy, rock bottom, sold-our-soul-to-the-devil, type of sexiness that comes with hitting a point of addiction that descends into complete degeneracy.

Al is not even a human on this record. He’s something further evolved via self-destruction. He’s like some alien mutant demon creature screaming from the other side of the door to Hell. I saw him on both this tour and the Filth Pig tour and I can tell you that he was truly frightening. It was like coming face to face with pure evil. And the vibe that creates in a club is pure magic.

Okay, enough jerking off for now . . . I just REALLY REALLY love Junkie Al and miss him. Yes, I’m glad he’s off the junk and do ultimately wish the best for him, but I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. Al and Heroin are like peanut butter and chocolate. Put one in the other and you’re gonna get something delicious.

You’ve just perfectly described why i think this is probably Ministry’s best album, much better put than i could do sir! It’s pure insanity from the first note to the last, scary, black, evil and full of filth and addiction. And desperation, as you rightly say. I always thought Al was fucked up before i heard this, and this album confirmed it, only he was actually much worse than i’d ever expected. Barker’s bass has never been more sinister, i love the loose-yet-insistent drums, and the use of the almost out of place instruments like banjo and sax really adds to the whole grim vibe. Although it certainly is crazy, grim and dark, i find some of it quite triumphant, like 10/10. Vex and Siolence and a few of the other tracks are the best things Ministry ever did.

I found this cover of that track on Youtube, quite interesting. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8K1lZRUwI3E

or maybe they weren’t knowing exactly what they were doing…
or maybe they had “fuck it, lets do it like this” attitude…

either way, however it might be, it’s a time stamp of that period for Ministry

now; about faults of DSOTS, how about:

  • fucking ty coon vocals on whole 2 tracks
  • no extended version of Step (and Nursing Home), removed samples from original version of Supermanic

thats about it… yes its weird it wasnt out on vinyl, becasue true running time of album is 45mins, easily split 23min/21min for side A and B without any track order changes.

i guess lack of promotion and lack of enthusiasm from the band maybe or just state they were in affected that too… maybe low sales as well… i mean if those extended nursing home and especially - especially step - version were existing on a shitty quality leak tape, they were definitely planned for a single release. didnt happen :frowning:

Does anybody think Happy Dust could fit as an intro?

i thought about it, but its kind of too long to be intro for that album and has that western-y vibe that compared to the rest of the album is just out of place, no matter where you put happy dust in dsots - start, middle or the end.

i have same trouble with “what about us” - i know it was written for the movie, but it was based on the riff/sounds that they already had at that moment for sure. and it still sounds more dsots’ey than animositisomina’ey.

I think Happy Dust would have fit nicely at the end of DSOTS…I think it’s perfect for the intro to the Sphinctour dvd,that’s for sure…

I love What About Us…such a killer tune…

i guess lack of promotion and lack of enthusiasm from the band maybe or just state they were in affected that too

Here’s an interview with Paul. I think I’ve posted this before and I’m sure some of you have seen in elsewhere.

http://www.nyrock.com/interviews/ministry_int.htm

[reply]i guess lack of promotion and lack of enthusiasm from the band maybe or just state they were in affected that too

Here’s an interview with Paul. I think I’ve posted this before and I’m sure some of you have seen in elsewhere.

http://www.nyrock.com/interviews/ministry_int.htm[/reply]

“I’m not defending drugs.Personally I like them…” Haha!

Speaking of Happy Dust…wasn’t this part of the more ambient/electronic songs that didn’t make the cut? I heard Paul re-used the songs in another project. Are they any good?