Remembering Ministry

Discussion
1

If we assume that Ministry is now extinct (i.e. no new albums, songs and so forth disbarring reissues and such) then we can neatly categorize their albums to these categories (defined by who primaily wrote the music during such times) :

The Ministry Years : With Sympathy - 12’’ Inch Singles
The Jourgenson Years : TLORAH - Psalm 69
The Barker Years : Filth Pig - Animositisomina
The Bush Years : HOTM - The Last Sucker
Swansong : Cover Up!

So… What would be your favorite era of Ministry music? And why? What era do you hate? Why? When did you get into them? Did you ever come to love what you hated about them? Or vice versa?

I know we have new members on here and quite a few old ones as well so just wanted to re-hash this and see where everyone falls on the subject.

As for me? I got into Ministry during what I call the Ministry years. Found 'em during Twitch thanks to my sister who is 12 years older than me. Loved it immediately and it grew with each album. When they started to get more popular with my age group (The end of the Jourgenson years - specifically Psalm 69) I kind of started to drift from them as it pissed me off that all these new pleebs were coming in.

And then… silence.

The Fall/Reload was quietly stored on a bottom shelf of a local record store in my mall several years later. Filth Pig dropped and it opened a new world of music for me. Still one of my top 3 favorites by the band to this day. Everyone I knew hated it and all the pleebs that latched on from Psalm seemed quickly repulsed so I was happy. Dark Side came out a few years later and for a long time I thought that it was the only Ministry album to truly suck. I loved Animositisomina and everything after more and more fervently, feeling they were finally gearing back up to par with each album until…

The Last Sucker. And yeah… It was a sucker of an album. In the years in between I had come to love Dark Side. It took me a while to get it but once I did it became an integral part of my Ministry catalogue.

As far as love? I love everything they did in all their years and side projects other than The Last Sucker and Cover Up. Truly terrible end to a once mighty band. As far as I hate? Everything I did hate about Ministry I came to love within a year or two after my first reactions.

** My favorite era was without a doubt, and no slight intended to “the man”, The Barker Years. Filth, Dark Side and Animositisomina were their best albums. Other eras have had some great stuff but not like those albums did.
** Most “eh” era for me would be the Ministry Years, as I really have to be in the mood for this stuff. It’s too dancy and synthy for my general tastes.
** Most Progressive era would be of course, the Jourgenson Years. While it pretty much started in Twitch, technically speaking, the works done on TLORAH through Psalm 69 are without doubt the strongest staple and statement Ministry ever made. Not to mention all of their influential side projects came out throughout this time also. Just all in all “The Golden Era Of Grandpa Al”.

Can’t say anything too much in either direction for the Bush Era. Really dig on most of the music. Really hate on most of the lyrics. Really hate on the repetitiveness and lack of originality as I’ve come to love with Ministry but loved the simpleness of just getting back to thrash and punk roots.

So… that’s my story. Dig it or hate it. Don’t care. Write one yourself.

2

The Ministry Years : With Sympathy - 12’’ Inch Singles
The Jourgenson Years : TLORAH - Psalm 69
The Barker Years : Filth Pig - Animositisomina
The Bush Years : HOTM - The Last Sucker
Swansong : Cover Up!

Well, you skipped Twitch, unless you’re placing that before 12" Inch Singles. Nevertheless, my favorite period is what you call “The Jourgenson Years” which I would actually call “The Collaborative Years”. That’s when Al and Paul and Bill and Chris and Ogre and the freaking Grand Wizard was in Ministry and everyone and their uncle was involved in various side-projects. You can’t beat that stuff.

Also, I don’t consider “Cover Up” to be a Ministry release - I consider “Ministry & Co-Conspirators” to be a totally separate side project. It hurts less that way.

3

Well, you skipped Twitch, unless you’re placing that before 12" Inch Singles. Nevertheless, my favorite period is what you call “The Jourgenson Years” which I would actually call “The Collaborative Years”. That’s when Al and Paul and Bill and Chris and Ogre and the freaking Grand Wizard was in Ministry and everyone and their uncle was involved in various side-projects. You can’t beat that stuff.

Also, I don’t consider “Cover Up” to be a Ministry release - I consider “Ministry & Co-Conspirators” to be a totally separate side project. It hurts less that way.

Yeah, I am considering Twitch before 12’’ Singles as in the year that they were released. You got Twitch in at '85 and 12 Inch in around '86/'87 even though most of the material is older or around the same time as the Twitch stuff.

And as far as Cover Up! being Ministry and Co. however you want to say it right there in big ugly bold letters is the word MINISTRY at the front of the line so that pretty much seals it for me as being a Ministry release.

4

got introduced to ministry in 2001, didn’t like 'em at first, checked out spoon, twitch, mind, lorah and psalm. the most appealing of all the cds was of course psalm. i listened to them all couple of times, and set them aside. then couple of months latter when i got to listen to in case, ministry finally hit me, i was getting more and more into them since.

the most favourite era of mine overall in without doubt from 1984 to 1988, i.e. early post-sympathy 12" singles to twitch finally into lorah, where you can hear how the suond gradually changes from poppy halloween to something like crash and burn. mind is really great album too, it has variety in music and vocals (unlike bush trilogy albums) but it feels like a whole… thing, without even being a “concept album”, which is great.

psalm seems so uneven to me today, i mean, nwo is great, classic, timeless song, but just one fix - i got tired of it. hotrod, umm yeah, also overplayed a bit. hero, meh. corrosion is great though.

then came the time when i got really into pig/spoon/animosity “trilogy” too. i like them as well. mentioning that, i also love the early “faggy” 1981 - 1983 period, sure it’s cheesy and corny, but fuck it, i enjoy it very much. same old madness fucking rules!!

then, since 2004, the disappointments began. first, the online chat log, where al stated something like “yeah new album will be hard fast and lots of g. w. bush bashing”, blah blah blah. the album has its moments, but overall it’s just standard subpar thrash-metal stuff, so there. then another online chat log, al says he’s making “some awesome remixes, more g. w. bashing!”, wtf. it was rantology, which turned out to be a piece of shit, except three tracks.

then rio grande, which was sort of like houses but more trebly and it used same fucking roaring crowd sample through the whole album, bad sampling that feels just out of place (in the “old days” ministry had badass top-notch sampling), and again bad lyrics.

then last sucker finally had some bass but it still sucked, being more of the same run of the mill metal, not to mention “swang song” of cover up which was totally bad. the beatles cover was really nice though.

i don’t really like nu-ministry and nu-revco. it’s just too different, there’s no atmosphere left in the albums, there’s no mix of tribal, urban and claustrophobic feeling that all the previous albums did have. the post-barker albums don’t “suffocate” you, don’t freak you out. and nu-revco is just too dumb and juvenile, it tries to be funny but the “humor” is just too infantile.

as it turns out for now, ministry probably will appear now and then here and there, even after the “farewell tour” (more like bush trilogy + cover up promo tour) - that track on the wicked lake ost and ncis theme remix, and revco still has to release a new album (which leaked like six months ago or something). so who knows, maybe in a couple of years ministry will be back with something, but their latest output has been more and more mediocre, so i don’t hope for too much (and haven’t been since 2005).

sorry this post turned into rant how the ministry sucks now, lol. but on the other hand, any old unreleased or live stuff is twice as interesting, and prongs did deliver a massive amount of song of the week goodness and old interviews, etc. it was great, and for that ministry stuff i still have interest for!

6

I’d go with the Jourgenson years.

7

Did you have an epiphany before writing this gobbledygook, Young Padawan Learner? Is yr underwear too tight? Has that percodan addiction grown to gargantuan proportions?

Hmmmm…but to be honest, yr musings on the career of the late, great Jourgemeister are not wholly unwarranted - as Ministry has been a part of my life since 1991. Personally, it was seeing the Jesus Built My Hotrod video clip at 2am on cable tv that won me over. I was 18 at the time. Young, dumb and full of a white sticky substance which had me captivated. Needless to say this new form of ‘outsider’ music left quite an impression on me (as I was quite the impressionable type) and so the next day I burnt all my Scritti Politti albums and was reborn.

So in response I shall say this:

Ministry pre-Barker blows chunks.

Ministry post-Barker picks up those chunks and attempts to swallow them whole, in a vain attempt to restore something mildly resembling blatant self gratification, only to regurgitate said chunks all over the kitchen bench.

Yes, The Bush Years are truly hideous - I liken the output from this period to something Korn might attempt to pass up as some sort of dubass, hazy socio-political commentary numetal sludge to please Motorhead fans - and with an annoying drum machine melody to boot.

And what the fuck is up with End Of Days?!?!?

The less said about Cover Up the better. And I mean it. I do believe I could put together a better ‘covers’ album in 30 minutes using only an accordion, a wurlitzer organ from the late '70s, the cake mixer from under our sink which hasn’t worked since Pink Floyd were last considered ‘psychedelic’ and the two Seventh Day Adventist girls who knocked at my door at 8am this morning.

Al Jourgenson should be shackled and forced to watch every movie that Kate Hudson has made in the last 5 years for forcing this monstrosity upon us.

As for the Barker years, I pretty much like it all excpet for Animositisomina, which has the odd decent track (Leper, Unsung) but is mostly post punk metal crud.

And yes, like you, my young Padawan, I too rejected Dark Side in its entirety before eventually (like seven years later) succumbing to its wonderfully dark poison.

p.s I think you mean ‘plebs’ and not ‘pleebs’!!

8

#1 Barker years (Minus Animosity- but as was said, save for a song or two here and there, but rather forgettable)
#2 Jourgensen years
#3 Bush years
#4 Ministry years
(various farts, belches and other bodily noises from jourgensen can fight to fill slots 5-9)
#10 Swansong
Late,
grmpysmrf

9

i guess everybody here forgets that al and paul did LORAH together and PSALM 69. sleepless months at the old chicago trax. i don’t consider those the jourgensen years. everything prior, yes.and that’s when all the side projects crept up.

11

My favorite period would be from Twitch to Psalm 69. I like all of Ministry’s albums to varying degrees, but this is the timeframe I listen to repeatedly. Twitch is just an amazingly inventive and different album. LORAH pretty much defines what we call modern industrial music. Mind and Psalm are both definitive industrial-metal albums. I don’t get tired of any of these discs, and they are (mostly) solid all the way through.

12

So… What would be your favorite era of Ministry music? And why? What era do you hate? Why? When did you get into them? Did you ever come to love what you hated about them? Or vice versa?

Favorite: The Jourgenson Years : TLORAH - Psalm 69
Why: Angry 19 year old - very aggressive and confrontational
Hate: The shitty trax because they suck rotten eggs and stink like both too.
Discovered: 1992 - Blown away by Psalm 69, so much so, that it was life altering
Grew on me: DSotS and FP

13

My first introduction to Ministry, like so many others, was “The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste,” which I picked up used for seven bucks in late 2003. The album totally blew my mind, but “Dream Song” really cemented Ministry’s place in my heart, and opened up the dark, unknown world of industrial music to me.

I kinda discovered the rest of their material very unchronologically. I believe Psalm followed Mind, then Houses, which were all fantastic (though Houses grew old really quickly, then grew decent again), but the next one fascinated me more than anything, and was probably the first pure electronic-based album I’d ever listened to: “Twitch.”

The album was just plain fucking WEIRD to me, but my God, did I play it to death. I quickly became somewhat infamous in my old high school for listening to this motherfucker all the time and offering it to people to listen to, earning me the nickname “Twitch,” which has pretty well stuck since then.

Everything since then is rather fuzz at the mo, but I do know that it’s definitely been one hell of a ride. It’s crazy that I’ve only been listening to these guys for about six years.

My favorite era of Ministry is definitely the '95-03 years, because I’m absolutely gay for Paul and because that’s where most of my absolute favorite Ministry songs are. Though I do love the experimental/downright goofy material from '86 and back.

My least favorite, as much as I hate jumping on the bandwagon, is everything post '04. A few REALLY good tracks here and there, but nothing really holds my interest here. Hell, I STILL have yet to listen to TLS in its entirety…

Favorite album is DSOTS, with “Twitch” coming in a very close second. DSOTS has the honor of blowing more speakers than any other record in my collection. Gotta love that bass on “Kaif.”

[cool]

14

Though I agree with the time quadrants I would categorise as follows:

'81-'87: the Jourgensen years
'88-'92/4: the collaborative years pt.I
'95-'03: the collaborative years pt.II
'04-'08: the years of regret

Discovery: early '99: listened to the redline/whiteline version of JBMHR on a mix tape my bro had. Thought it was great, just the kind of music I wanted. Bro told me who they were and that they were “industrial” which was a music term I had not heard of before even though I was listening to NIN since '95. I wore out the tape listening to JBMHR.

In the summer of '99 I picked up LORAH and TMIATTTT. The former did not hit me immediately as I was expecting something faster while the latter impressed me more. But over the following weeks they both became greats. A few months later I was given the wonderful present of Psalm 69, Filth Pig and Dark Side together. Psalm 69 was an immediate favourite while the others I was expecting/hoping to be growers. Needless to say the rest of '99 into '00 was all about the Dark Side of Filth. In '01 I picked up Twitch and thought it was very good. Since then I have filled out the Ministry cataglogue (with the exception of everything since Rio)

The Best: The Collaborative years pt. II: Ten years ago I would have said the LORAH-Psalm period but Filth and Dark Side have come to represent the essence of what I feel was best about Ministry, music that is ugly and that grates but develops into something wonderful despite the often simplistic and/or unoriginal riffs. What those albums thought me about music is that the best music is something you have to listen to repeatedly, to work for, to unearth the quality inherent in it.

The Worst: the years of regret: When Barker left, Ministry should have folded into a lockbox, sealed and shut tight. When Houses came out I tried hard to like it, but it was a bad sign when after 10 or so listens it seemed to get worse. The first “bad album” of Ministry. When Rio came out I tried again, but not as hard as I knew to expect just another generic heavy metal album. At first I thought it better than Houses because it was heavier but then I just developed this profound apathy for it and have not listened to it in about 3 years. Did not pick up Last Sucker, heard a few samples of the songs and I shuddered. R.I.P. That cover album is, what Danny D Lewis says in ‘There Will Be Blood’, the afterbirth… its slithered out of it’s mother filth, they should have put it in a glass jar on the mantlepiece. The cover of What A Wonderful World is, definitively, the worst song of all time.

Despite the quality in some of pre Barker Ministry and Animositisomina if I were to refine Ministry down into the essential albums I’d go for the big 5:

The Land of Rape and Honey
The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste
Psalm 69
Filth Pig
Dark Side of the Spoon

16

My first introduction to Ministry, like so many others, was “The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste,” which I picked up used for seven bucks in late 2003. The album totally blew my mind, but “Dream Song” really cemented Ministry’s place in my heart, and opened up the dark, unknown world of industrial music to me.

Are you me eleven years ago? Same thing happened to me…except my cousin gave it to me (CASSETTE VERSION!) before we saw Star Wars in the theater, also my first. Good times.

“Dream Song” was my nightly sleep song…

17

The only thing I can really tolerate is Early Trax, Twitch, LORAH starting with track 4, and bits and pieces from FP and DSOTS.

18

Got into them shortly before Mind dropped. First exposure was Twitch which I didn’t feel thaaat much at the time. Funny enough it is now my favorite aka heavy i-pod rotation. listened the living shit out of LORAH and MIND. had super high hopes for PSALM, especially after JBMHR hit the airwaves. got PSALM the day it was released and thought “excuse me??? are you fucking kidding me? this is super boring metal”. I have to add that I am more a punk/indie rock kinda guy, most metal never appealed to me.
went to see one of their first euro shows ever, hamburg 1992. again, nothing but a big let down. none of the MIND Tour crazyness. instead a static metal pose routine torture went on for 80 minutes. Only highlight being Chris Connelly doing So What. So I was pretty much done with the band after that. All future releases to me were either annoying like the sludgy Filth Pig or flat out an attempt to rehash what has been created in the years between 88 to 90. The exception being the track The Fall offa Filth Pig. This one ranks amongst the great classics.
Why do I still care? Because all the force that has been used to run the ship into the ground since 1992 couldn’t damage the majestic monolith that is the 83-91/92 period.

19

I first got into Ministry sometime in late '86 early '87 so it was Twitch that started it all for me, and is still a benchmark of electronic music. I was listening to Skinny Puppy at the time first and was looking for other music that was similar. So by the time LORAH came out I already had With Sympathy on cassette, and Revco’s Big Sexy Land so I was floored by the change seeing the video for Stigmata for the first time. After that I haunted my local indie record shop until the album actually came out. The cassette didn’t have Hizbollah, or I Prefer on it but over all it really cemented all the things I wanted to hear at the time. So I guess I am more of a fan of the '86-'91 period with the side projects as I was a Wax Trax! mailorder junkie.

TMIATTTT came next and was great except that it ran out of steam before the end. (Although Dream Song is a great closer to the album even if it is Mrs J talking on it) I saw that tour and it still sticks out as one of the best shows I’ve been to. The line-up was perfect, and is to me the pinnacle of Ministry’s existence.

Jesus Built My Hotrod was the taste of things to come, and while I really like the song it just seems to be a Revolting Cocks track. Then Psalm 69 came out after a long wait, and frankly I wasn’t impressed with the sound of it . To me the album was a step backwards into the thrash/heavy metal ghetto I was trying to get out of in mid '80s. NWO sounded a little too much like Burning Inside at the time, although this time the second half of the album sounded better to me. So for a decade I didn’t even own it, or Filth Pig until after watching the Sphinctour dvd. Now much like Darkside I love them all, and can appreciate them alongside my favs Twitch and LORAH.

The latter stuff post Barker just seems a little lazy, some of the music is pretty good, but lyrically it tends to lack a bit. I don’t hate it and have come to accept it for what it is, the Ministry machine grinding to a halt. It might be sad to some, but it doesn’t erase the really good albums. Will we ever see anymore releases under the Ministry moniker? At this point it should end, but any archival releases would be welcome.

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[reply]
My first introduction to Ministry, like so many others, was “The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste,” which I picked up used for seven bucks in late 2003. The album totally blew my mind, but “Dream Song” really cemented Ministry’s place in my heart, and opened up the dark, unknown world of industrial music to me.

Are you me eleven years ago? Same thing happened to me…except my cousin gave it to me (CASSETTE VERSION!) before we saw Star Wars in the theater, also my first. Good times.

“Dream Song” was my nightly sleep song…
[/reply]

Apparently. “Dream Song” can put me out more gently than half a bottle of NyQuil when set on repeat.

[cool]

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[reply]
[reply]
My first introduction to Ministry, like so many others, was “The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste,” which I picked up used for seven bucks in late 2003. The album totally blew my mind, but “Dream Song” really cemented Ministry’s place in my heart, and opened up the dark, unknown world of industrial music to me.

Are you me eleven years ago? Same thing happened to me…except my cousin gave it to me (CASSETTE VERSION!) before we saw Star Wars in the theater, also my first. Good times.

“Dream Song” was my nightly sleep song…
[/reply]

Apparently. “Dream Song” can put me out more gently than half a bottle of NyQuil when set on repeat.

[cool][/reply] Dream Song is sort of an anomaly to me it shows that Al and Paul can do an ambient track better than Delerium yet the only thing close to it in the rest of the Ministry catalogue is The Fall, or Hizbollah. What a side project that would have been if they’d snuck in a whole album like that.

I seem to remember Dream Song being played over the PA before the guys hit the stage on the Mind tour, but I may be wrong.

22

once paul left, for me minitstry went from a band where i liked almost every song off the cds I had, to one of those bands that I like a bunch of songs from, but not any cds front to back, except the covers cd… for some reason i’m in the major minority in that i like all the songs off that cd… well, i do tend to shut it off after the first wonderful world though.

23

My tastes don’t fit the eras very well so I’ll do this:

Amazing: Twitch, Filth Pig, DSotS
Good/Great: LoRaH, Mind, Psalm 69
Fun/Not Great: Trilogy, With Sympathy
Shit: Cover Up.