[#e5e5e5]rock loving white people here. Not much into hiphop…but since Trent is diving in, i’m checking it out.[/#e5e5e5]
honestly- I might like hip hop more so than I do rock. I probably own more “rock” than “hip hop” cds though. that’s why it’s cool when I see Broadrick, who we’d normally associate with “rock” of some type to do something like later day Techno Animal, or in this case, Trent with Saul’s music. I don’t mind the “n” word, around where I live it’s hood, so I hear it on a daily basis.
Saul sounds like Seal (and Lenny) at times too.
Just curious, is anyone here black (specifically african american)? Or is it just a bunch of rock loving white people (outside of afra) bitching about a black dude using the n word too much?
I know a lot of white people listen to rap, but in this case we know that a lot of people are only checking this album out because of reznor’s participation on it. On the couple of rap forums i frequent i rarely see criticism of the N word used in rap music, especially when it is used by a highly educated person like Saul. I don’t think the word really has shock value in rap music anymore does it?
I suppose you’ll all be skipping Nas’s new album “Nigger” coming out next month then?
I think it’s just time to let it die.
saul’s take on the use of “the word”
Saul Williams posted February 20, 2006 03:32 PM
…My use of NGH is there for several reasons. One, as an observer of our society and culture I’ve observed that it doesn’t seem to be going anywhere. Intellects want to stop using it. Meanwhile cats on the street assert that those intellects must not be “Real NGHs” I wrote this book for cats in the streets and prisons (intellects get enough books written for them. they can go purchase dj spooky’s Rhythm Science). Sometimes these cats come to readings, stand in the back, give me a pound as I exit and whisper in my ear “I love you, man. You my NGH”. Tears in their eyes and everything. These are my brightest moments. Like many a rapper out there, Kemet you can attest, we grew up surrounded by “gangsters”, young black men caught in the trap of poverty, violence, drugs, etc.many of these cats relate to the word NGH. Why? 'Cause that’s exactly what they feel like. Why? because like an ipod, that word can carry 400 yrs/gigabytes of experience in it’s tiny frame. Why? Maybe because that word didn’t start with slavery and opporession. as I said in an earlier thread, the Niger river had that name before Europeans came to Africa. There are several indigenous African languages where there are words very close to the word “*****” that have an array of meaning, some of them sacred. Perhaps the word hasn’t disappeared for reasons beyond our brief knowledge of it’s history. It may be the only word in the American English Lexicon of actual African origin (this is a mere hypothesis). Anyway, in regards to writing “for the streets”, my personal experience does not put me in a position to talk down to anyone. Their lingo is my lingo. I plead Special Ed “I’m outspoken. My language is broken into a slang, but it’s just the dialect that I select when I hang.” And it’s true. I use the word NGH in specific company. Welcome to the gang. My thought was to see what would happen if we lifted the word up rather than always trying to push it down (and under the rug). So I approached it as if it were the name of God. In the first poem (and the 6 poems that follow), NGH WHT is the name of God, like YHWH is the name of god in ancient Judaic texts.
If you don’t like reading the word aloud then read it to yourself. The truth ain’t always PC and comfortable. In Black America’s quest for freedom we must be free to associate and/or disassociate with the terms of our oppression. NGH is one of those terms. Do as you will. I do not aim to encourage it’s usage, nor do I wish to deny it. I guess in the case of the paragraph above, that would make me agnostic…haha. I expect that this discussion will go on for years. I am open to the possibility of coming to a conclusion where I decide not to use the word. I am also open to the possibility of it being overused to the point of us simply growing tired of it. That was also taken into positive consideration when I decided to “lift it up”.
Yeah, I was gonna mention that odd spelling of the word, there - NGH. I was three chapters into one of his books before I realized that’s what he was saying.
Entertaining read.
downloaded this from the site, $5, not a great follow up to his last LP but a good collab with Trent, agree about the use of the N word, it’s suprising to hear SW use it so much.
On first hearing it sounds almost Identical to Year Zero music wise …It’s nothing outlandishly new, everything he is saying other artists have already done but he’s likeable.
[cool]
I’d have to disagree with you on both counts there. I believe this album is far better than Year Zero. In fact most NIN fans will tell you that. Also with regards to the 2nd comment there i take it you haven’t heard Saul’s 1st and 2nd album not to mention his early 12"s as for me that is totally unique music and lyric wise. I say that as a rabid record collecter who has hundreds and hundreds of records from many different genres.
One thing i do agree with you on is that this is ndeed a fantastic record. Well done saul and co.
Well I happen to love Year Zero, so I guess I’m not part of the majority of fans.
I haven’t heard sauls other albums, I’m going on what I saw of him live.
Disagree or agree I don’t really care, in my own personal opinion the music on Niggy Tardust to me, is VERY similar to year Zero, which isn’t a bad thing.
Both albums imo are fantastic.
I love YZ as well, it’s probably my third favorite NIN (behind “Broken” and “TDS”). I also hear a lot of similarities between YZ and “Niggy”. A number of the backing tracks sound like they could have been generated in the same sessions. Guess that means that I’m not a true fan.
It’s ok, I’m sure there are many more of us ‘untrue’ fans out there Green Death…
We likes what we likes and hears what we hears…
NIN’s always been more or less a hit-or miss band with me (usually miss). I loved Pretty Hate Machine and can barely tolerate anything else.
Go figure.