O Captain My Captain

Discussion
21

Yeah, I don’t know, Ambulance.
I can tell you that, while I’ve not had an immediate friend or family member die in such a manner, I am actually pretty appalled at how many friends of mine have had a family member commit suicide. Without even thinking hard there’s 5 that come to my mind immediately. And I don’t even really have a very wide social network.

While no one in my immediate family has killed themselves, there is depression and mental illness in my family and I can tell you that it is absolutely crippling.

Obviously this is much speculation as I wasn’t around 100 years ago, but I would suspect that the frequency of this suicide stuff is higher than it was in the past. I don’t know how much of it is the “go go go/ win win win” culture. I think a lot of it has to do with us evolving more and more into isolated beings. Our networks are becoming smaller and smaller and our human contact becoming less and less.

I live in a condo. There’s a door from my garage to my home and I NEVER talk to any of my neighbors, let alone even see them. It’s full occupancy in my complex, but it may as well be a ghost town. I can then go to my couch and do my shopping from my computer and order a pizza for delivery or go through the drive through tell a speaker box to give me some fried chicken. We really don’t ever need to talk to people, nowadays.

And I’m a damn social butterfly (just ask Grumpy). But even I can fall into the trap of becoming a total hermit. I can only imagine how bad it is for people who don’t naturally seek out human interaction. I don’t know what it was like for Robin Williams, but I suspect things could get worse if you have a big giant house and assistants to go out and do your day to day crap (get dry cleaning, go pick up milk from the store, etc.) that might force some of us to see people.

I don’t know. I’m just babbling, I guess. I don’t have a big support net for myself, but I’m certainly grateful for the people I have.

Anyway . . . yeah, stuff like this sucks. If there’s anything to take away from it, I guess it’s that we really don’t know necessarily know what our neighbors, coworkers, friends, etc. may be struggling with. We should all try to be better friends when we can and make an effort to not be assholes when we don’t have to be.

Okay, I’m out.
Cheers!

22

Just lost his will. Youd think he could just leave his house and be mobbed by dozens of adoring fans but when even the thought of that doesnt make you feel better or even doing it doesnt help its really sad. I wasnt a huge fan of his comedy as of late (i think his best stand up was in the 80’s) but its still shocking to me. im not necessarily “sad” over it (i am sad for his family) but i am in a state of awe. I think everyone knew he was manic. So i say again im shocked that im shocked.
Poor Conan obrien found out during the commercial break and informed the audience upon their return from break, i thought the guy was gonna cry right there on air. Sad situation

23

I wasnt a huge fan of his comedy as of late (i think his best stand up was in the 80’s)

I honestly didn’t like much at all in the last 15-20 years. I respected his talent and when he was good, he was really, really great. I’m not shocked or sad because I think we lost some great role model or national treasure of anything. I’m really just kind of bummed out by the situation of it. And yes, I know this happens with regular Joe Blows all the time and we don’t hear about it. But this was a famous dude that we all know of. And we all heard about it. And it’s making me sad. I guess it’s the familiarity of it that I find crushing. Helicopter crashes, robbery shootings, skiing accidents . . . all that is odd and removed enough to me that it’s shocking and tragic, but it doesn’t have that warm, dull, punch in my guts that this “mundane” hanging does. It’s too real. Too human.

25

Both of you are spot on

26

Very well said. It’s pretty shocking, he seemed a decent guy and had, outwardly, every reason to live, he had a family and was well-loved by so many people. In the tributes i’ve seen everyone from Arnold Schwarzenegger to Charlie Benante to the President of the United States talking about how great he was. I loved his parts in The Fisher King, One Hour Photo and Insomnia, enjoyed most of whatever standup stuff i’ve heard, watched Mork and Mindy as a kid and enjoyed plenty of his other stuff too. I couldn’t believe it when i heard he’d taken his own life, it’s really sad and i would never have thought of him as someone who could be in such a terrible place that he’d consider doing that.

This is a good read, Russell Brand (who i know a lot of people hate, but give it a try if you have time) talks about Robin Williams.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/aug/12/russell-brand-robin-williams-divine-madness-broken-world

27

As you are aware, my dad shot himself almost a year ago. He had absolutely no signs of depression, although I later found he was taking some anti-anxiety medication with side effects listed as sometimes causing suicidal thoughts. The day before he bought a nice brand new car and a new electric razor. He was very involved with the community - always helping out others. Right before he shot himself he was talking with my mom and told her some really dark stuff about his past and how he always kept thinking about it. Stuff that really makes no sense to think about. I won’t ago into what it was, though.

Yeah, my stepfather hung himself in the mid 80’s. I was about 15 at the time. When it happened he was no longer living with us (mum had not long finalised her second of three divorces) but it was still a shock. I couldn’t bring myself to go to the funeral and spent most of my teenage years blocking it out. It came back to haunt me in my late 20’s and I suffered some pretty severe bouts of anxiety and PTSD. I ended up ploughing my car into a brick wall on a rainy night. To this day I’ll tell myself “it was just an accident”, but if I look a little deeper it was definitely a cry for help.

A few years after my step dad’s death, a couple of buddies and I went to the cinema and saw Wild At Heart, the David Lynch film, which was playing at the time. Afterwards we went out for drinks but one of the group, a guy I had known for years and whom was teaching me to play the guitar, said he wasn’t in the mood and was going to “retire early for the night”. He said he had a lot on his mind.

We said our goodbyes and he left. Two hours later he wrapped a belt around his neck and hung himself in his bedroom closet.

28

If there is any good to come of this, I hope that it really starts other dialogues amongst people about depression and suicide. I think it is really too often dismissed or over-simplified in public discourse.

What has always been a really sore spot for me over the years is when, following such a tragedy, people say it was a “selfish act” or call the person names for committing it. It is so dismissive and arrogant that it just gets under my skin like nothing else.

Every case of suicide that has been close to me, and even ones like this where it’s pretty removed, yet publicly known, has been by GOOD PEOPLE. People that were generous, caring, selfless, and hard working. None of these people have ever taken “the easy way out” of anything, and I think to call suicide an “easy way out” is such crap.

Killing one’s self is anything but easy. It’s pretty much the darkest thing I can imagine, and it is so stupid to act as if these people didn’t care for those left behind. For someone to get to the point of killing his/herself, it is the act of someone who has found his/herself in such a pit of hopelessness and pain and anguish that this actually seems like the best option. I have been through times of darkness and pain, but the idea of killing myself always terrifies me. I think it terrifies most people. And I’m glad it does. Whether you think that is from God or it is our genetic survival instinct or you just don’t like pills, blood, heights, etc., that terror and fear is there to keep us alive. And yet, sometimes things get so bad for people that it fails anyway.

I’m actually really relieved that this story has been alive here for 3 days now and no schmucks have posted the predictable slams against the fallen, or used the case to get up on a soapbox and denigrate those who commit such acts.

I don’t really know where I was going with this, to tell you the truth. I guess I just got some darkness in my own heart and I’d rather follow my own advice right now and get it out than have it fester.

I did want to say to Ambulance and DJ Pon 3 and anyone else that has had to deal with the fallout of this type of stuff . . . . . Dudes, I am so very sorry for what you’ve had to go through. It doesn’t matter how fresh or how old, but that carries weight on you that no one can imagine and should not ever assume to understand. I pray for peace and strength for everyone and your families.

And as trivial or superficial as this may sound coming from just another dude on the internet, if anyone ever finds themself in a hole and doesn’t have anyone else to talk to, please let me know. I’ll give you my number, or I can call you, or whatever. I’m not a counselor. I’m not a psychologist. I have no agenda. I just absolutely hate this stuff and if there are some people that “just have no one to turn to”, well, you do now.

I guess that’s it for now.

29

If there is any good to come of this, I hope that it really starts other dialogues amongst people about depression and suicide. I think it is really too often dismissed or over-simplified in public discourse.

What has always been a really sore spot for me over the years is when, following such a tragedy, people say it was a “selfish act” or call the person names for committing it. It is so dismissive and arrogant that it just gets under my skin like nothing else.

Every case of suicide that has been close to me, and even ones like this where it’s pretty removed, yet publicly known, has been by GOOD PEOPLE. People that were generous, caring, selfless, and hard working. None of these people have ever taken “the easy way out” of anything, and I think to call suicide an “easy way out” is such crap.

Killing one’s self is anything but easy. It’s pretty much the darkest thing I can imagine, and it is so stupid to act as if these people didn’t care for those left behind. For someone to get to the point of killing his/herself, it is the act of someone who has found his/herself in such a pit of hopelessness and pain and anguish that this actually seems like the best option. I have been through times of darkness and pain, but the idea of killing myself always terrifies me. I think it terrifies most people. And I’m glad it does. Whether you think that is from God or it is our genetic survival instinct or you just don’t like pills, blood, heights, etc., that terror and fear is there to keep us alive. And yet, sometimes things get so bad for people that it fails anyway.

I’m actually really relieved that this story has been alive here for 3 days now and no schmucks have posted the predictable slams against the fallen, or used the case to get up on a soapbox and denigrate those who commit such acts.

I don’t really know where I was going with this, to tell you the truth. I guess I just got some darkness in my own heart and I’d rather follow my own advice right now and get it out than have it fester.

I did want to say to Ambulance and DJ Pon 3 and anyone else that has had to deal with the fallout of this type of stuff . . . . . Dudes, I am so very sorry for what you’ve had to go through. It doesn’t matter how fresh or how old, but that carries weight on you that no one can imagine and should not ever assume to understand. I pray for peace and strength for everyone and your families.

And as trivial or superficial as this may sound coming from just another dude on the internet, if anyone ever finds themself in a hole and doesn’t have anyone else to talk to, please let me know. I’ll give you my number, or I can call you, or whatever. I’m not a counselor. I’m not a psychologist. I have no agenda. I just absolutely hate this stuff and if there are some people that “just have no one to turn to”, well, you do now.

I guess that’s it for now.

This is a great and important post…I would like to elaborate but am just popping in during work…I have a lot to say about this as well but Gunnar just summed up a lot of my thoughts on the subject…well said…

30

Uh… anyone hear about the trolls who targeted his daughter Zelda over twitter?

The standards of the trolls is a seemingly bottomless pit.

31

Uh… anyone hear about the trolls who targeted his daughter Zelda over twitter?

The standards of the trolls is a seemingly bottomless pit.

Yeah, I did, actually.
Really gross stuff.

32

And as trivial or superficial as this may sound coming from just another dude on the internet, if anyone ever finds themself in a hole and doesn’t have anyone else to talk to, please let me know. I’ll give you my number, or I can call you, or whatever. I’m not a counselor. I’m not a psychologist. I have no agenda. I just absolutely hate this stuff and if there are some people that “just have no one to turn to”, well, you do now.

I guess that’s it for now.

Not trivial or superficial at all; it’s these unexpected flourishes of real concern that keep me involved in this whole goofy post-industrial culture. People in this supposedly “cynical, nihilist” culture are often more civil than huge chunks of the mainstream.

And yes the whole “selfish act” cliche - I have caught myself sitting around with a gun pointed at my own head more times than I care to mention, and generally some concern for surviving family and friends kept me from finishing the deed, but not everyone in a suicidal state can rationalize things like this. I don’t think for a moment that the majority of them WANT to make others feel the misery they felt while alive.

33

If there is any good to come of this, I hope that it really starts other dialogues amongst people about depression and suicide. I think it is really too often dismissed or over-simplified in public discourse.

What has always been a really sore spot for me over the years is when, following such a tragedy, people say it was a “selfish act” or call the person names for committing it. It is so dismissive and arrogant that it just gets under my skin like nothing else.

Every case of suicide that has been close to me, and even ones like this where it’s pretty removed, yet publicly known, has been by GOOD PEOPLE. People that were generous, caring, selfless, and hard working. None of these people have ever taken “the easy way out” of anything, and I think to call suicide an “easy way out” is such crap.

Killing one’s self is anything but easy. It’s pretty much the darkest thing I can imagine, and it is so stupid to act as if these people didn’t care for those left behind. For someone to get to the point of killing his/herself, it is the act of someone who has found his/herself in such a pit of hopelessness and pain and anguish that this actually seems like the best option. I have been through times of darkness and pain, but the idea of killing myself always terrifies me. I think it terrifies most people. And I’m glad it does. Whether you think that is from God or it is our genetic survival instinct or you just don’t like pills, blood, heights, etc., that terror and fear is there to keep us alive. And yet, sometimes things get so bad for people that it fails anyway.

I’m actually really relieved that this story has been alive here for 3 days now and no schmucks have posted the predictable slams against the fallen, or used the case to get up on a soapbox and denigrate those who commit such acts.

I don’t really know where I was going with this, to tell you the truth. I guess I just got some darkness in my own heart and I’d rather follow my own advice right now and get it out than have it fester.

I did want to say to Ambulance and DJ Pon 3 and anyone else that has had to deal with the fallout of this type of stuff . . . . . Dudes, I am so very sorry for what you’ve had to go through. It doesn’t matter how fresh or how old, but that carries weight on you that no one can imagine and should not ever assume to understand. I pray for peace and strength for everyone and your families.

And as trivial or superficial as this may sound coming from just another dude on the internet, if anyone ever finds themself in a hole and doesn’t have anyone else to talk to, please let me know. I’ll give you my number, or I can call you, or whatever. I’m not a counselor. I’m not a psychologist. I have no agenda. I just absolutely hate this stuff and if there are some people that “just have no one to turn to”, well, you do now.

I guess that’s it for now.

For somebody who often comes across as a total wanker, that’s a really genuinely sensitive, positive and constructive post. And that’s a heartfelt compliment.

There have been so many backward cunts on Twitter who simply don’t understand the horrific depths that people can find themselves in.

34

Apparently, his wife released a statement today saying he had just recently been diagnosed with Parkinson’s disease.

35

I have caught myself sitting around with a gun pointed at my own head more times than I care to mention, and generally some concern for surviving family and friends kept me from finishing the deed…

Whaaat!?!?!?

Dude…DON’T!!

[shocked]

36

[reply]
I have caught myself sitting around with a gun pointed at my own head more times than I care to mention, and generally some concern for surviving family and friends kept me from finishing the deed…

Whaaat!?!?!?

Dude…DON’T!!

[shocked][/reply]

thank you - honestly - for your concern. I think those days are pretty much behind me.

I’m also one with a pretty depressive temperament; things that have happened to me aren’t more unique in their tragedy than any of the other incidents that have already been mentioned on here, but they’ve been enough to lead to these spells of total despondency. I spent much of my early life having authority figures tell me I was destined for greatness, a ‘genius’ and ‘gifted’ etc., and around the time I realized this wasn’t the case I started getting more miserable. Which then begat a cycle of alienating lots of people, which then led to further fuck-ups, and back to a deepening of the feelings I’d already been dealing with.

My advice for any prospective suicides would be this - don’t let visions of your ideal self, or a ‘life script’ in which you were supposed to do ‘x’ thing by ‘y’ year, control you. What initially seems like motivation will be a recipe for misery. Gradually learning to enjoy processes over products - for example, just being lost in the moment of creating some intense monument of sound, instead of whining about how nobody else has bought a copy of it - has saved my life.

Not everyone will get to that state, but, following from Gunnar’s offer, I’m happy to share with anyone whatever ‘techniques’ I’ve learned to dig myself out from a hole of pointless self-flagellating.

37

This shocked me big time and really, really bummed me out. I always found Robin obnoxious in interviews but found him incredibly charming on film and a genuinely nice and happy guy (though I know fuck all about him personally). He had a very… sincere smile and… kind eyes…
Do I need to go to some Christian “retreat” for typing that?

One of my favorite films “One Hour Photo” - he’s so amazing in it. The mannerisms, clothing, the way he speaks to people meekly and shy and desperate, it’s all so well done. People always talk about how “creepy” the film is but I always remember how sad it is. I pitied his character. Desperate for someone to care, helpless, history of sexual abuse, velcro shoes, etc.

But yeah, Robin’s death bummed me the fuck out and the last I saw of him was on an a really well done episode of Louis titled “Barney/Never” (season 3 episode 6. watch it!) where they actually end up at a funeral for a friend where no one else shows up, etc. - just watch it.

And then out of nowhere he’s dead at like 63 and you realize depression and killing yourself doesn’t just go away as you grow older. I suppose the bad times don’t always pass?

39

I tried to kill myself in the 10th grade but I was stupid and totally messed it up. I took 5 aspirin thinking that would do the trick. I remember going to bed and waking up feeling very refreshed. I obviously slept pretty well. The next day, in my English class, my teacher called on my for an answer to the homework. I said that I didn’t do it because I didn’t expect to be at school that day. She said something like “Even if you weren’t going to be here you still have to do the homework.” I really hated that bitch. I never had a desire to kill myself after that incident.

Oh yeah, I had one of those temporary reprieves from youthful self-hating courtesy of a bitchy English teacher…who literally throttled me in front of the class once when I made a “smart” remark. I didn’t know it was possible to laugh while being throttled, as the whole idea of a septuagenarian ‘church lady’ type pantomiming the act of killing me was just too much.

40

I’m also one with a pretty depressive temperament; things that have happened to me aren’t more unique in their tragedy than any of the other incidents that have already been mentioned on here, but they’ve been enough to lead to these spells of total despondency. I spent much of my early life having authority figures tell me I was destined for greatness, a ‘genius’ and ‘gifted’ etc., and around the time I realized this wasn’t the case I started getting more miserable. Which then begat a cycle of alienating lots of people, which then led to further fuck-ups, and back to a deepening of the feelings I’d already been dealing with.

My advice for any prospective suicides would be this - don’t let visions of your ideal self, or a ‘life script’ in which you were supposed to do ‘x’ thing by ‘y’ year, control you. What initially seems like motivation will be a recipe for misery. Gradually learning to enjoy processes over products - for example, just being lost in the moment of creating some intense monument of sound, instead of whining about how nobody else has bought a copy of it - has saved my life.

words to live by
cheers man…[/reply]